The PC V is now available for all 2009 bikes, and sort of available for the 2008 bikes - BUT you need to tell them the PC V is for a 2009 bike. For example: If you own a 2008 TE250 and want a PC V the you need to order a PC V from them stating your bike is a 2009 TE250 - or they will not sell it to you. This means the Auto Tune option is also available for the 2008/9 bikes. The main advantage of the Auto Tune is to alleviate the need for precise maps especially when a particular bike with different configurations (e.g. exhaust) has not been tested/dynoed. It will also compensate for altitude, temperature, etc. Now the bad news: The Auto Tune is the only significant difference between the PC III and PC V. There is no other significant performance enhancement from the users perspective. A well tuned PC V will not run any better than a well tuned PC III. This information comes directly from the Tech support manager of Dynojet. I'm emailing a link to this thread to him in case I've misunderstood some aspect of this. Special thanks to 'cbreakin' for loaning his 2009 SM510 so this testing could be done. Video of testing: http://cafehusky.smugmug.com/gallery/9031661_biq3S/1/#600906380_hXt4f-A-LB The PC V system: Cbreakin's bike: It's not what, but who you know sometimes. After many hours on the phone I finally connected with this guy - Dusty. Incredible person that impresses me greatly He has been there a long time and I learned much.
Unless you use the Auto tune, correct? The III and V base unit are basically the same thing, running the same software, but the V can interface with the auto tune and adjust the map to achieve a correct fuel / air ratio.
That is correct - from a users/buyers point of view they are basically the same except only the PC V can use Auto Tune. Auto Tune is a piece of hardware that is in a picture above.
Thanks for the info Dean. I think AutoTune is a significant advantage! Why spend ~$200-300 for a dyno session to create a static tuned map when the autotune can dynamically create it? Has anyone run a V w/auto tune on an 08 yet, or is this just the word from the tuner in Vegas?
No one has used a PC V on any Husqvarna bike until yesterday as per Dustin at Dynojet, although someone out there may have used it and not said anything. The PC V is required to use the Auto Tune module. Ergo the Auto Tune has yet to be used on any Husqvarna bike - not even the one that was tested yesterday. The reason the Auto Tune was not used yesterday is because it adds nothing to that particular bikes situation - The exhaust is not going to be changed, it will not be ridden at high elevations in the mountains and then in low elevations. From other peoples perspective the Auto Tune could be a huge advantage because then a custom map is not required. Especially if Dynojet has not developed a map for it i.e. someone with a 2008 TE250 can now buy a PC V & auto tune - then it will adjust to a target AFR regardless of exhaust, airbox, etc. Go to this post and give him some good rep (little box in the upper right hand corner of the post) http://www.cafehusky.com/forums/showthread.php?p=40066#post40066 And Brian & Valerie Wilson for storing the bike for a night
This could be the single most important post... Dynojet has tested many 2008 Husqvarna bikes. They even flew to FBF to develop maps on the 2008 bikes. There are 3 basic ECU software versions for the Husqvarna bikes at this time - it is a Mikuni ECU. Early 2008 Late 2008 2009 Every 2008 they have tested has been way way too rich. Ostensibly the tested the bikes in 'race mode' with the 2.2kohm resister installed at the harness where the O2 sensor was connected. They 2009 SM510 tested yesterday was almost perfect. It really is not needed for that bike. My preliminary conclusion: If you have a 2008 bike with EFI then you should do something. It is difficult to say after testing 1 bike but 2009 bikes may not need a whole lot done. A PC III or PC V and a proper dyno testing would help tremendously - they do the same thing. The PC III could in theory be purchased used (if someone is selling one). The PC V probably does not have many used at this time. If you want to just buy a PC V & Auto Tune then the dyno testing is unnecessary. I'm basing my conclusion on the incredibly articulate person that did the testing. He is a top guy at a Dyno jet, the people that answer the phones report to him. He is the guy in the video. Of extreme importance is that there has been no testing in 'real life' situations by dynojet as far as I know - with data logging on a Husqvarna bike. He indeed turned the throttle rapidly & slowly to ensure that the bike was working well. He did not actually ride the bike in a race or trail ride. Rapidly backing off the throttle entering into a sharp corner with the bike leaning over has not been tested. Nor has the Auto Tune been tested in those conditions on a Husqvarna bike. The Auto Tune makes adjustments based on an a (Dynojet provided) O2 sensor that screws in where the Factory O2 sensor was. Those adjustments need to be made at the right frequency. Too fast and the system is unstable, too slow and the Auto Tune would do little good. That is how systems work. Some of you may remember the really basic 'PID' control loop (proportional, Integral, Derivative), there are constants that need to be adjusted in a system like that. If I had to take a wild guess: they may be trying to mimic a bike with a standard Power Commander that was tuned up on a dyno i.e. they may be making changes over a course of minutes and ignore the rapidly changing throttle positions. I'll try to get more information on that. The bike is still at Dynojet and I will be picking it up on Monday. If anyone has any questions now would be a good time to ask them so I can wrap this up then. .
I'm curious how they would do "Real World" testing. In other words, they dyno the bike and come up with a map. Let's say they had a chance to actually ride the bike in real situations with this new map, how then would they translate this "trail testing" of the new FI map to make refinements to that new map? Is there some kind of metering mechanism to record what is going on during trail rides so that fine tuning/adjustments can be made for a riders style of riding (lugger, revver, throttle chopper)? Or would they be able to send out/sell these PC units with their customized maps and have customers report back to them "TRAIL" results and come up with personal options of refinement. Or is that just way above the capabilities of a fuel injection system? David
Yes, please ask Dustin if he'd like a real world tester for the V with AutoTune with a 08, err 09 TE250.
The thing on the right of the pic of the PC V system can data log, but that is a whole nuther topic. I'll ask! Don't think so though...
So, it has a basic "PID" loop like this that needs to be adjusted for your application? It's going to have some generic set points in it and you have to fine tune it, am I understanding that correctly? May not be to bad for me, I'm pretty good with "PID" loop tuning, if I do say so myself. Well, I'm the guy they always have look at the process loop tuning anyway.
I should have deleted what I had typed cause it only added to the confusion. I 'was wondering out loud' how rapidly they would be adjusting the efi based on the Auto Tune box. Now that I've had time to think about this they probably only auto tune over a long period of time. I need to be really careful when typing because this is a difficult topic to understand.
Auto Tune sounds like a learning software item. Sort of like how my Pioneer Plasma gets used to the room light etc. through a sensor. Does that sound right?
That's a good question for Dustin, how frequently are the samples taken from the O2 sensor, and how many samples does it take to cause an adjustment to the curve, pulse, etc. I bet both happen pretty quickly, CPUs are fast these days. Is the V in a epoxy encasement or is it a PCB inside of a hollow plastic box? The III looked pretty fragile, hopefully the V is built to take offroad.
Much thanks to Dean for heading this project up. For those of you who don't know Dean has gone through great lengths and spend endless hours to bring the PC-V to the Husky community. As far as I know he dose not even own an FI bike. He's gone through all this trouble making arrangements and following through just to make things better for the Husky community as whole! Thanks Dean, and thank you for taking time to post the results, awesome pics, and the dyno graph! The entire Husky community is in debt to you!
Sort of. The Auto Tune is constantly monitoring the O2 and adjusting the injector pulse width accordingly. The Pioneer system only does that when you tell it to which is usually when the system or furniture has been moved. The question is - how often is that occurring. One of 2 things could be happening: -constant adjustments in the millisecond time frame (I don't think so) -slower adjustments are made e.g. adjusting the PC V mapping parameters over a period of minutes (I think this is what is happening) Regarding how often things are adjusted, see above - yes I will confirm. The PC V looked durable enough to me. I can do an in depth review at some point. It did not have the 'sink marks' of an epoxy case but the electronics could be. Durability of the boxes have been proven in the field. Your welcome, I like to help when I am able. Besides it is fun doing these types of things.
Where are you buying them at? The powercammender web site list a part #, but doesnt say you can buy it yet?
I am not buying one cause I don't have an efi bike Call the factory. I doubt their website will be updated soon. This is breaking news from the Tech support manager. Tell you what - let me get you part numbers on Monday
