'88 430 auto trans fluid question

After lots of research on this site, I decided to go with the Pentosin atf fluid. My question is, what are the symptoms of the fluid being worn out? I had fresh fluid (1 qt) in it for the 1 hour race, and I noticed that it needed more throttle on the low torque situations 30 min into the race. I pulled it apart tonight and no broken springs, etc. I also noticed it as a bit harder to get into gear and sometimes stalled when it did go into gear....sounds like springs? They all look intact, I'll post pics tomorrow. The fluid was dark but not burnt, and there was "sludge" on the drain plug as expected, but no tell tale signs....
Thanks,
W

Fluid needs to be changed every ride, not necessarily because it gets worn out or breaks down but to flush out all the metal bits that wear off the shoes and drums. All the impurities in the oil that circulate through the output shaft one way sprags and bearings is the real problem and shorten their life.
I do a total tranny teardown and flush after every race (2-1/2hrs). It's the only way to stay on top of things, besides it only takes about an hour or so.
Riding the Auto always puts a silly grin on my face and well worth the effort put into maintenance.
The secret to making things last is to always get on the throttle hard to ensure the clutch shoes don't slip too much and create heat.

Enjoy.

I watched your video and I realise you were in a hurry to make the start, but you really have to let the revs come right down to a smooth idle before engaging drive. When you pull it all apart inspect the engagement dogs on the drive gears, if they wear too much and become rounded off it will not stay in drive. A lot of parts can still be found for the Auto but I am not aware of any NOS drive gears in existence anywhere. You definitely have to make them last.

I do not really agree with your choice of oil, but Palito is right you need to change the oil after every event as there are no filters and it carries all the crap, typically that's 3 hours for me. If you want to do fast dead engine starts you need to click it into gear as the engine fires, easy not. There is a post some where on here showing a cable conversion with handle bar lever for just this sort of operation. But like Palito says spares, particularly the engaging parts are like rocking horse droppings' and you need to look after them.
But the buzz you get riding one is worth all the hassle.

The only way to get fast dead engine starts, lever on the bar. Release the lever on the kick through before it fires. All parts are Husky parts except the bracket that limits the actuating arm in both positions. I built this in 1986, last used it 2 weeks ago.

I pulled the cover off last night and no broken springs.... lots of "shavings" on the drain plug though. Nice set-up Palito, but I'm not too worried about fast starts (although I was in a hurry and didn't treat the old girl too well going into gear) as I'm more worried about braking something than getting a mid-pack start (i have cornered the market on bad starts). I will pull it completely down and clean/inspect everything to see what it's status is. Now, what fluid do you guys recommend? with all the info out there, the opinions range wildly....I want to give it the best chance to survive as it's a ton of fun to ride!
Thanks for the input,
w

I will only use the genuine Mobil HVI 26 oil as recommended by Husky. 1 U.S. quart does not sound enough to me. That is a tad under 1 litre. My 390 box takes a good 1.25 litres.
If you are finding the pick up changes after riding it for awhile, check the grooves in the shoes. They may need a "seeing to" with a hacksaw blade.

I agree with a bunch of the above stuff. Filtering and letting the oil stand so stuff could settle out was something I did for a while before I got pails of the exxon univis J26. It is by now re named a bit and costs what seems like 5 times as much.

The sound a kind of shreiking was the indication I noticed but attributed it to the spiral groove in the first gear drum (angled grooved shoes 420 and prior) being not as new. The three speed one does hold less oil than the four speed one, 420 and prior. There is a little plug for the level isn't there.

I'm using Shell Tellus 32 oil, comes in a 20 litre pail for about $80CDN. Very close in properties to original spec oil.
The liquid cooled 430 takes only 750ml. It has an oil level inspection hole on the side cover, make sure the bike is sitting level and slowly fill until you see oil at this hole. Should be 750ml more or less.
I recently acquired a 1985 500AE, the transmission is very similar using all the same wear parts as the 430 however the gear box itself is 30mm wider and all the shafts, the primary crank stub, the secondary shaft that 2nd & 3rd ride on and the kick start shaft are all 30mm longer. Only the output assembly that houses the one way sprag clutches is identical to the 430. This tranny calls for 1 litre I believe.

Paul.

If you really cannot find the original spec oil I believe some of the hydraulic oils used in hydraulic breakers have a similar spec including the Shell oil mentioned above.

The 500 three speed does have a wider piece on the left side and you likely are correct in that it has it's own oil volume spec. I have noticed that the crank stub is longer, there are two bearings for the first gear clutch instead of one like the 430. I never noticed the front transmission shaft was longer but that makes sense to reach the bearing pocket. There is a picture of that 500 in the 430 manual just to confuse and frustrate if one doesn't understand what has been done.

I have been using the Pentosin ATF in my 360, 390 and 420 autos now for about the last six years or so and have had great results with it. Shifts feel great compared to the original Ohlins oil. And the shifts stayed firm even after the oil was extremely hot. I have had NO trans failures other than two broken springs and I believe that is because I got a bad set of NOS springs that were not heat treated correctly. The clutch springs failed within two rides, One spring broke the first ride after installing the new springs and then the second spring broke during the second ride. After that I change back to a good set of used "tested" springs. As mentioned above is the main thing is to keep fresh/clean oil in the trans. I love riding my automatics!
Marty

The other thing I need to do is sort out the rich blubber off idle to 1/4 throttle, I suspect it's not helping with the acceleration and possibly contributing to the needing of "more throttle opening" at low end torque situations?
Thanks for all the input on this, it's really a fun bike to ride.
w

pics of springs..
.

Here's a pigtail broken spring. On my bike it often breaks near the hub !


And Univis HVI 26, not too hard to find in France, just ordered at an industrial parts shop .

Since I can't find Mobil HVI 26 in my part of the US,

I have used B&M Trick Shift ATF. It does not promote slipping as it is made for old Ford automatics which are made to shift hard.
I'm about to try Spectro Shock Oil 7.5wt Golden, as recommended by George Erl. It has the similar viscosity specs as the original Ohlins oil, only cheaper.

Can't find univis hvi 26 !!!
Everfree, it is hard to live in a third world country !

I have been using Pentosin ATF fluid, it comes out clean and not burnt smelling. One of the auto guys on here all uses it without problems....I can get it from my local auto parts store.

Fill the oil until it starts to weep out the oil level hole. Then put the screw back in!

Don't fill by volume - fill to the correct level indicated by the oil level weep hole.

A 500 will take a bit more than 1 litre if it is bone dry. If changing oil it takes a little less as some remains in the cases when drained.

Ha. Yes, for sure.
At least we have the internet!