Goodbye, Carnegie

Discussion in 'Newsroom' started by WoodsChick, Dec 15, 2009.

  1. WoodsChick Administrator

    Location:
    Oakland, CA Miramonte, CA
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    3 Terras, 2 `07 SM610s, `09 WB165,
    Other Motorcycles:
    KTM, GasGas, Suzuki, Honda
    As if losing Clear Creek wasn't enough...

    http://www.cyclenews.com/articles/industry-news/2009/12/15/state-park-gets-shut-down...


    In a recent court action, a judge in Alameda County has ordered a closure of one of California's State Parks. Last week, Judge Frank Roesch ordered the closure of Carnegie State Vehicle Recreation Area (SVRA) based on his own interpretation of the appropriate application of water quality standards.
    Despite years of working with regulatory agencies to address issues surrounding water quality in the Corral Hollow Watershed, Judge Roesch ordered the park, located in the hills east of Livermore, closed until State Parks files and receives approval of or a waiver for a report of waste discharge from the Central Valley Regional Water Quality Control Board. This approval process could take months.

    The order stems from a complaint filed by Public Employees for Environmental Responsibility (PEER) and the California Sportfishing Protection Alliance. The group's complaint alleged OHV activities at Carnegie SVRA are causing discharge to enter Corral Hollow Creek, which flows through the park. The creek only runs 4 to 6 weeks a year, and after leaving the park eventually runs out into an agriculture field and disappears into the ground.

    "If regulatory agencies are satisfied with what the park has been doing, why does this judge in Alameda think he knows better than the environmental professionals?," asked Dave Pickett, President of American Motorcyclist Association District 36 and member of the Carnegie OHV Taskforce. "This is an attempt by special interests groups to highjack lasting collaborative solutions, and deny family recreation enjoyed by over a 100,000 visitors to this park annually. This is just flat wrong!"

    For years, staff from Carnegie has been working with the Regional Water Board and nearby property owners to address water quality issues in Corral Hollow Creek, which runs through the State Park. In 2004, State Parks initiated a watershed assessment, paid for with OHV user fees, to diagnose potential issues in the watershed and design fixes. Regulatory agencies together with State Parks are identifying solutions to address problems.

    "We have been working with the park to address the hill climbs in Carnegie, which have been problematic, as well as making sure the vehicles are out of the creek. But we have no control over Hetch Hetchy, who illegally performed work in the creek bed, or the munitions testing facility," said Pickett, referring to the activities of neighbors of the park. "It is troubling when the OHV community wants to work within the system and is now taking all the blame."

    According to Don Amador, Western Representative for the BlueRibbon Coalition and fellow member of the Carnegie Taskforce, "If the park is forced to close, more than 100,000 park visitors will be displaced. The closure will impact other OHV recreation areas, causing overcrowding and unanticipated effects from the overload. The closure will not hasten better water quality, but is just another example of the Plaintiffs grandstanding and misusing environmental law to enact a political agenda that is anti-recreation and anti-park."

    "Californians would be better served if PEER extended the hand of partnership to legitimately address the issue, rather than using the court system to close a park at a time when residents have been fighting so hard to keep State Parks open. This court decision is deeply troubling on any number of levels," Amador concludes...



    AngryChick
  2. robertaccio Husqvarna
    Pro Class

    Location:
    San Diego, Ca
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    2021 Husqvarna TE300i
    Other Motorcycles:
    99 HusqvarnaTE610, 94 Husaberg FC501
    whoa,, hope the AMA, BRC can get things working there?
  3. Motosportz CH Sponsor

    Location:
    Vancouver WA
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    2021 TE250i, 570 Berg, 500 KTM, 790R
    Other Motorcycles:
    many
    I rode clear creek for two days on a road trip. That was a hoot. Sorry to see it go. Now this. :banghead:

    [IMG]

    [IMG]

    [IMG]

    Good time for sure.
  4. Coffee CH Owner

    Location:
    Between homes - in ft Wayne IN
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    2006 TE250, 2013 TR650 Terra - sold
    Current status? Now closed? I would call but even if they were open today they would be closing about now.
  5. columbia510 Husqvarna
    AA Class

    Location:
    columbia,ca
    Thanks for the pictures of the BEST place on EARTH to ride. RIP the "Creek".
  6. WoodsChick Administrator

    Location:
    Oakland, CA Miramonte, CA
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    3 Terras, 2 `07 SM610s, `09 WB165,
    Other Motorcycles:
    KTM, GasGas, Suzuki, Honda
    Well one ranger said they were open for business, and she had never heard anything about water quality issues, permits or lawsuits. I find it hard to believe she knew nothing about it. Even I knew something was brewing as far back as September. Another ranger said he'd heard about the judge's decision but he just brushed it off and said they'd be open for business.

    Supposedly the closure is temporary (hrmph...where have we heard that before?) and is only until Carnegie gets the proper permits and so forth, but this is only the beginning, I'm sure. That's how it all started with Clear Creek. PEER has made no bones about their feelings for OHV, and SVRAs in general, as can be seen here...

    http://www.peer.org/news/news_id.php?row_id=1247


    And on that note, how many of us here belong to the Blue Ribbon Coalition? If you enjoy riding your dirtbike, and you don't want to see this sort of stuff happen at your favorite riding area in the very near future, you might want to check out the BRC and see what it's all about...

    www.sharetrails.org



    WoodsChick
  7. WoodsChick Administrator

    Location:
    Oakland, CA Miramonte, CA
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    3 Terras, 2 `07 SM610s, `09 WB165,
    Other Motorcycles:
    KTM, GasGas, Suzuki, Honda

    Speaking of Clear Creek, the BLM finally released the DEIS last week...only a year later than promised...

    http://www.blm.gov/pgdata/etc/medial...ft_RMP-EIS.pdf

    The BLM made it clear they prefer the option that includes this statement...

    "Vehicle touring would be limited to less than 5 days/year and pedestrian activity limited to less than 12 days/year."

    So basically...no OHV.

    The comment period closes in March. Please sharpen your pencils, boys and girls.



    WoodsChick
  8. CKPC Husqvarna
    AA Class

    Location:
    EastBay (NorCal)
    Per the court the park has 10 days from the hearing date to obtain the proper permit, which is not going to happen. So for at least a few more days it's open but once it closes I doubt will ever be able to ride there again.

    Behold the future of OHV in CA! If this sticks groups will file against every OHV and open ride area. The State does not have the funds to fight the suits nor the funds to fix what the suits ask for so I don't see any good outcome.
  9. WoodsChick Administrator

    Location:
    Oakland, CA Miramonte, CA
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    3 Terras, 2 `07 SM610s, `09 WB165,
    Other Motorcycles:
    KTM, GasGas, Suzuki, Honda
    Exactly! The above highlighted sentence is the real danger here. It will set a very dangerous precedent, especially in these economic times, and we will see our riding areas start to fall like so many doomed dominoes.



    WoodsChick
  10. Coffee CH Owner

    Location:
    Between homes - in ft Wayne IN
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    2006 TE250, 2013 TR650 Terra - sold
    Just called, it still seems to be open... I may try on Saturday, or Monday.
  11. CKPC Husqvarna
    AA Class

    Location:
    EastBay (NorCal)
    This was posted on Thumper Talk by "robnmp"..anyone that lives in CA or has used these parks needs to sign this and as said before the other parks and ride areas will be next!! The suit is a joke as this park sits in a valley that contains a super fund site, a main highway both of which also drain into the same creek and the creek itself passes through and ends in an old dump site never reaching any body of water...

    Here is a link to the petition that is going around!
    http://www.carnegieforever.org/index.php

    and if you think because you do not use the park it doesn't matter,Daphne Greene, Deputy Director of OHV has mentioned " that Peer has allready requested soil samples for both hollister and PC." IT'S TIME TO TAKE ACTION!


    If your not a local Hollister is Hollister Hills OHV south of San Jose and PC is Prarie City OHV in Sacramento, both like Carnegie are the main OHV areas in the Bay Area.
  12. Coffee CH Owner

    Location:
    Between homes - in ft Wayne IN
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    2006 TE250, 2013 TR650 Terra - sold
    Brewster just posted this on TT:

    Looks like Carnegie will stay open until at least Jan. 6, 2010. I just checked the County courthouse website and Division was granted a "stay" (temporary reprieve) on the closure.

    EDIT: new estimate is somewhere between 12/26 and 12/28
  13. WoodsChick Administrator

    Location:
    Oakland, CA Miramonte, CA
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    3 Terras, 2 `07 SM610s, `09 WB165,
    Other Motorcycles:
    KTM, GasGas, Suzuki, Honda

    Yep, and someone that was at Carnegie today said they're doing a ton of work in the creekbed, presumably in preparation for getting the needed permits. I hope it all goes well. Of course, PEER already has their sights set on Hollister and Prairie City next. Once those little problems have been taken care of I'm sure they'll move on to Gorman or Mammoth Bar...that is if they don't hone in on taking our green sticker funds first...

    http://www.peer.org/news/news_id.php?row_id=1284

    WoodsChick
  14. ow595 Husqvarna
    A Class

    Location:
    Santa Cruz
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    None
    Other Motorcycles:
    KTM, Ducati, triumph, etc.
    I can't understand someones interest in shutting down a OHV park, when you would think they should support them by allowing riding to happen in controlled areas.
    We all must act.

    Who is this PEER group?

    Is this the person causing the issues?

    "PEER’s California field office opened in May of 1998 to work with state environmental employees. Karen Schambach, Coordinator of California PEER, has a strong track record as an activist in off-road vehicle and forestry issues. Karen has a Bachelor’s degree in Environmental Studies, and worked as a paralegal specializing in employment law prior to becoming PEER’s California representative. As a volunteer for various environmental groups she gained extensive experience with the National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA) and California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA), as well as experience working with agency whistle blowers.

    An organization she founded in 1986 (Center for Sierra Nevada Conservation) has had a strong influence on environmental polices on the Eldorado National Forest. The group’s challenge to California’s guidelines for the state’s off–road vehicle program resulted in a new regulation package.

    When not on the phone or in front of a computer, Karen loves sailing and backpacking. She and her late husband, David, spent 10 years sailing their 32 foot Westsail 30,000 miles from California to the East Coast, to Europe and the Carribean.

    Karen Schambach
    P.O. Box 4057
    Georgetown, CA 95634
    Phone: (530)333-2545
    Email: capeer@peer.org
    "


    ow595
    Santa Cruz, Ca
  15. CKPC Husqvarna
    AA Class

    Location:
    EastBay (NorCal)
    That is her. She is very anti-OHV from what I have read, also against Mt. Biking and horses being allowed in parks.
  16. Coffee CH Owner

    Location:
    Between homes - in ft Wayne IN
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    2006 TE250, 2013 TR650 Terra - sold
    I've been spending much time out there, including today.

    I'll go back out on Monday, many important people have been invited to attend an 'event' out there, I'm not sure who will actually show up. I've also been working with another geographically based forum called Southbayriders.com and some details have been posted there.

    I am also attempting to dig a little deeper into some ideas/issues.


    Tuesday they will also be open, and I will be there again. Then it will be shut down.



    I did meet a couple of nice Husqvarna people out there today, and gave them a couple of cafe husky stickers.
  17. jerbear610 Husqvarna
    Pro Class

    Location:
    Sacramento,CA
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    14' WR300, 11' TE511, 06'TE610 sold
    Other Motorcycles:
    11' Husaberg FE570, 15' Beta 300RR
    Dean, I wonder if that was you that I saw on a couple different occasions Saturday.
    I know there were a few Husky's out there but there was one guy that I crossed paths
    with a couple times and we sort of just nodded at each other but I couldn't make out
    what he was riding other than the fact that it was a red and white TE. Looked like a 250.
    I didn't see any other blue and yellow ones aside from mine. This was later in the afternoon.
  18. Coffee CH Owner

    Location:
    Between homes - in ft Wayne IN
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    2006 TE250, 2013 TR650 Terra - sold
    I thought I saw you. I was riding over to the store from the maintenance shack end, and a pickup was just pulling in and parking, in the first major parking area on the left hand side after turning right from the entrance. I was really hungry and was headed to the store for one of their Polish sausages. :) maybe 130-2pm?

    By the time I got back I did not see you any more...

    Mine is indeed a TE250 red/white with no graphics of any kind except the swing arm sticker... which is ripped. I do not set a very good example I suppose.

    I will also be there both tomorrow and Tuesday.


    The park may open up once again, but I seriously doubt it will be as open as it is now.
  19. PhilM Husqvarna

    Yep, her and that whack job hacker ex-neighbor of mine are the reason why we are loosing our public lands in the El Dorado National Forests.

    Next on their agenda is: Prairie City. Believe it. They want that place closed as well....
  20. WoodsChick Administrator

    Location:
    Oakland, CA Miramonte, CA
    Husqvarna Motorcycle:
    3 Terras, 2 `07 SM610s, `09 WB165,
    Other Motorcycles:
    KTM, GasGas, Suzuki, Honda
    I just saw a story on KTVU Channel 2 news about Carnegie! I'm sure it will be shown on the 10pm news, too.

    It was very well done, although I really would have liked some mention of the fact that Carnegie (and every other SVRA) is a state park that is entirely self-funded and is not dependent on state funds to operate.
    There was a phone interview with Karen Schambach and she came off as very weak and ill-prepared. She talked about the bikes going through the creek "and, well, stirring up the dirt." That's a paraphrase, as I can't remember her exact words, but for being The Enemy she sounded remarkably whiny and petty. By the way, it was raining and the creek crossings were shown and you'll never guess what was not to be seen in the creek :D That's right...there was no water flowing.

    The reporters interviewed a father from Manteca, and he talked about the family aspect of riding. They later interviewed his kid and he was a very well-spoken young man.

    Daphne Green was also interviewed...

    Hey! Eric said he just saw a trailer for the story on CBS Channel 5!!

    ...anyway, Daphne's interview was really good, too :thumbsup:

    All in all, it was a good showing and the TV story was sympathetic to our side for once! Hurray for the good guys!

    I just watched the coverage on CBS and it was a good story, too!
    They interviewed a young girl and she said riding at Carnegie provides a great opportunity for her family to come together and spend time together having fun. They filmed a reporter standing under an umbrella in the rain at the creek's edge (which was still dry) and he said the creek was dry 10 to 11 months out of the year. Daphne Green also had a great interview where she basically said it was really unfair to single out OHV as the cause of the problem in the creek, and mentioned that other land owners (homes, cattle ranches, an explosives testing facility right across the street fer cryin out loud!) also bear responsibility.

    They did mention on Channel 2 that there were 500 people there today. If they'd held this event on a weekend and not on a very rainy Monday, there would have been at least twice that number of people there. I think I saw Rodney Smith's box van there :)



    WoodsChick