Just bought a 2007 TE610 with about 1,600 miles on it. I wanted to check the valves as I don't believe the p.o. had done them yet. I searched and read what I could about the procedure and learned that it isn't nearly as easy as adjusting valves on my TE 250. I was doing quite well, had the valve covers off and was ready to find TDC. Anyway, I got careless. I decided to use a small wooden dowel down the spark plug hole instead of the suggested soda straw in order to find TDC. I didn't realize something bad could happen, then voila.... there's now some wood on top of my piston. Something chewed part of the end off the dowel (up to an inch, about pencil size diameter). There has to be a better way to find TDC that to stick something down the plug hole..... Can someone explain to me what happened? Is there likely to be damage? More importantly, what do I do now? I assume I will have to pull the head. If so, I'll need some instruction. Feeling rather stupid about this. Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.
The space between the piston and cylinder head chamber valves are very small compared to your dowel. Likely the piston rose in the cylinder while you were turning the crankshaft and caught the dowel at an angle which bent and snapped it on the way up. Wood is not very slippery, and will easily catch against the sharp threaded plug hole, so if you were not holding it aligned, it likely did not slide up easily on its own and got caught. A straw is slick and compresses if need be and won't scratch (like a slick metal rod alternative could). You could try to vacuum the bit out and then try to look inside. Without a proper inspection instrument you won't really know though without pulling the head. I would be worried about small bits that are too long to vacuum out getting caught in the valve seats causing uneven seating pressure (side load) and thus maybe bent valve stems or damaged valve seals. I would not count on any long bits burning and blowing out fast enough. How lucky do you feel? :-) I doubt you have any damage at this point assuming you have not started the engine. The wood is soft and probably out of the way of the valve seats so far thanks to gravity. - Mike
Thank you Mike. Yeah, I naively was under the impression that the dowel would simply ride on top of the piston until I could figure out TDC. Obviously, one must know precisely where you are in the stroke before trying the soda straw technique. I think I rotated the rear wheel about 1/4 turn. So, did the very top of the piston grab the dowel end and chew it off against the cylinder wall? I'm trying to picture what happened. I thought of trying to vaccuum the pieces out and may try that first. I will have to find some clear tubing to attach to the end of a shop vac hose. I certainly haven't started it and thought about the valve issues you mentioned. Where are the wood pieces likely to be? Riding on top of the piston or would it have dropped below? The wood is soft and light. It won't drop to the bottom of the oil, it will ride on top of it. Simply draining the oil may get it out, may not. After trying a little down-hole vaccuuming, anyone know the best course of getting a stupid mistake like this resolved? I know I'll get it fixed, but damn, I didn't need this project. p.s. zero alcohol was involved in this mishap.
Thanks Rock.... That's reassuring. I still don't fully understand why the end of the dowel was chewed off. Can anyone elaborate on what they would do besides a down-hole vac attempt? How big a job is pulling the head? Would that be best?
The wood is likely sitting on top of the piston. There is not much room on the sides, and it would not get past the rings. The clear tube is a good idea. You might also start with a clean vacuum cleaner bag/cannister. Then you could verify what came out and piece the dowel back together and account for what is missing, if anything. The pieces will likely be large splinters I think. I figure it simply broke off at the bottom of the plug hole after it got caught sideways a bit. The wood is soft so slowly hand cranking is not likely to do any damage, it is getting caught in the valves that would concern me. If you proceed to the head removal, it takes some time but not hard. You might need a few new tools. Check out this link. http://www.supermotojunkie.com/showthread.php?t=60551 It will give you an idea of the process. The clear tube/clean vacuum would be my first choice :-). - Mike
You have four valves in a hemispherical arrangement with the spark plug roughly in the center. When the valves are on the overlap cycle you both the intake side and exhaust side open at the same time and if if you're dowel was large enough and at the right angle it can get trapped in between the valves and the top of the piston or in some cases it can actually get wedged in between two valves. I would just try to vacuum out everything as best as you can then bar the engine over by hand to make sure that nothing is binding if it will get trough a couple of revolutions without any significant binding (with the spark plug removed of course) then you should be OK. Don't feel to bad, you're not the first person to do this and likely wont be the last.
Good to hear guys. Thanks a bunch. Yeah, after thinking about Mike's explanation, I understand clearly what happened and am not so freaked out. It was the angle of the plug hole in relation to the cylinder that caused the bind. I will vac the hell out of it, then vac some more while making it go through some revolutions by turning the rear wheel. Pulling the head may not be necessary at this time. The write-up will surely come in handy someday, so thanks for that. Now, isn't there a marking for TDC somewhere on these 610's?
There is, but you have to drain the oil and pull the side cover to get to it. I use the soda straw method myself.
Progress, but still not there Thanks. I will never use a wooden dowel again. Guaranteed. I was able to vac out the smaller pieces, but there is one large piece that will come into view, but won't vac out. I have tried for a couple hours. I thought of turning the whole thing upsidedown, but then I'd actually be putting the piece of wood closer to the valves. Can anyone think of anything I should try?
Good idea Highside. The problem is that the little bugger moves out of view as soon as I take the vaccuum pressure off of the hole. I can see it for a split-second before is rolls out of view. I will try to get it to stay put in the middle by getting the piston more level and then maybe try to stab the piece with a straight pick. I don't think hemostats will have enough working room down that tiny hole.
I like that tool. That may be an option. The problem seems to be that the remaining piece is too large or too heavy to vac out. I will keep screwing with it, but it may have to be broken up into smaller bits to come out.
Can you float it out? By that, I mean make sure your piston is at TDC and the valves are closed. Pour oil into the spark plug hole and stir/agitate it to try to get the wood to float up to the hole. If you can fish it out this way, you can then get the majority of the oil out with suction.
If it is any reasurence I used a straw the first time checking my valves but decided to use a wood dowle the next time because I'm a carpenter and have access to lots of wood.......Now I will not because of the lesson you have imparted.
did the same thing.......and shudda known better.......you can remove the carb and exhaust and blow it out the exhaust side with any luck.....
All Clear The suggestion to blow the debris out the exhaust is what worked. I used compressed air down the spark plug hole. I removed both exhaust manifolds and had the exhaust valves open and the intake valves closed. The wood pieces came flying out. I will start it up tomorrow and don't think there will be any issues. This valve adjustment took much longer than the next ones will. I hate learning stuff the hard way.
