hot start issues: where to start 2012 TXC310

Ok. so I know this is a known issue but at the same time I'm not sure the best place to stat.

The issue at hand is the bikes Hot I stall and the starter doesn't work. Most of the time I can just kick the bike. Other times Its not so easy.

I'm going to check the valves tonight to get that ruled out. The bike has about 110 hours and runs well otherwise. The battery is good and the connection to the battery looks good. I've read some try switching out the relay and I do have access to one I can do that.

if this has all be hashed out before please just point me in the right directions.

thanks

Joe

So I checked the valves and they are a little loose plus reading the X lite starter threads it would seem people run the valves a little tighter over all then spec or at least on the decomp valve. I'm going to pull them tonight and see where my starting point is.

Joe

Its a good thread, I have had this issue before, but in the opposite direction, bike did not start cold. Maybe you would like to check the cooland sensor, on mine it was the issue.

This seems to be the best thread on the topic.

http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/te-250-310-xlite-starter-issues.24533/


As I get into it I'll follow some recommendations in it and post updates as I go.

Joe

Loose on the ex valve under the decompressor is not good.
Drop a thicker shim in and see what happens.

so I've read but how tight is too tight. I've read people are running the decompressor valve as tight as .005 and over all .006-.008 for the exhaust and .004-.006 for the intake.

My current reading are.
Left EXH .008 Right EXH .008

Left INT .007 Right INT .007

and will shoot for
Left EXH .006 Right EXH .007

Left INT .005 Right INT .005

I also read to check out the decompressor for wear. My bike has about 110 hours

Well the spec is I believe .008 and those clearances sound right. Too tight and you can burn a valve.

I found that it is hard to accurately measure the left ex valve because of the decompressor.

Frankly, I'd just drop a tighter shim in the left ex valve and see if it starts better then.

If not, I'd throw the old shim back in.....or if you can , just grind a thou off the existing shim and run .007 on the left exhaust valve and see if it helps

I adjusted mine to .007 about 2 yrs ago and it has been starting fine since then.

Use a 1/4 drive torque wrench on the cam caps @ 42in/lb on the small bolts and don't strip them!

Are you in NJ?

Yea after talking with a few friends I'm going to do just that. buy a new shim for the one valve and leave the rest alone for now.

Yes I'm in South Jersey, Moorestown. Where are you at?

Good Post Joe... (Posting so I'll be alerted to follow this_

So as things often go with used bikes I was treated to 3 bolt on the intake that were very buggered up and would not take the 40 in/lbs. Got a lot of good advice from R_little as well as my local dealer Bob @ central jersey cycles. Started off by getting things covered. Then clean out the holes with brake clean. Followed that with some tap solution and chasing the threads. I figured the next step would be pulling the head and using coils but as the gods would have it the new bolts held at 44 in/lbs so I put everything back and fired her up.

The pic just shows the shims. I use a little grease to hold to a pic when I put them in place.



Finished reading are.
Left EXH .007 Right EXH .008

Left INT .007 Right INT .007

Had the chance to get out on the trails for a 3 hours at a good clip and the Good and bad news is as followed. The Hot start issue has not gone away BUT was easier to kick start.

Next step is to pull the clutch and check out the ring pinion. Although it sounds like the starter is not getting power when the bike is hot I think it's an issue of the starter binding on something and the factory week starter can't overtake the force. however I'm not sure of that's possible as I don't have a lot of experience with the bike. I ordered a flywheel puller and holder and once we hit the dog days in a few weeks I'll dig in.I'll most likely buy the updated ring and pinion to have if need be.

Advice is welcome ;-)

Joe

It's not the clutch that you pull, but rather the magneto on the left side to get to the ring gear. Your symptoms were exactly as mine, and the updated gears cleared up my starter stalling. What seems to happen is the gear contact point roughen up and no longer turn.
I was out all day and the starter was like new. I hope it stays that way, and I make sure I don't overuse it. Good luck!

I think everyone is making the left exh .005

Yea that just seemed a bit tight to me. You figure that's 12.7 and factory is .20. I tried it a little tighter from where I was and I did noticed a difference.

airride,

cheers, I ordered the parts so hopefully I can dig in to it soon. I'll be excited to get this problem under control.

Joe

I think .-005 is a bit too tight.

Joe, pull the mag cover flywheel and replace the ring and pinion with updated parts.

The real problem is if the flywheel shears the key and the IGN timing gets too advanced . then the bike starts to kick back and blows stuff up.

OK, I spent sometime tonight looking over the manual. I guess I won't really know the condition of the Key till I get in there. I tried looking up the part but couldn't find it. I'll cross that bridge when I get to it. It would seem MANY of the threads I've read point back to the key but at the same time the two dealers I spoke to side they don'r normally sell them with the ring/pinion sets.

Last week I ordered the zipty fly wheel holder and puller. Bob says he's got the updated parts in stock so hopefully by the weekend I can get everything together.

Just updating this with a few pics for future readers. This problem isn't going anywhere and I'm sure we'll see 2013 and 14 running into issues. The process of inspecting isn't isn't hard, drain the oil. remove the 6 screwed. Note the ones at 12 and 6 are longer. wiggles off the cover, the magnet makes it hold tight. Once off a good light should allow you to inspect the gears.

Joe

With some holiday luck I should see the new ring & pinion set in the mail tomorrow along with the zipty flywheel holder so I can get things back together. So knowing that I decided to dig into things since I had the time.

R_Little is the man when it comes to these hot start issues and I've been PMing with him on and off thought this. That guys BTDT and I'm starting to also question the clutch or sprag that's just behind the fly wheel can als cause the starter to hang by binding or in some cases weld to the flywheel. Oh lastly lets not forget the woodruff key and all the shit that can go bad there.

So with all this rolling around I finished repairing the trigger on my impact gun +1 for Matco guns, you ant picking one up a harbor freight but they take a beating and keep on ticking.

I pulled the starter, used a 17mm on aforementioned impact gun and she popped off with no trouble. Used my puller to take the flywheel off followed by the sprag and gears.

I've posted some pictures but honestly I don't see anything that looks THAT bad. The rig for sure has some wear and chips in a few places. The sprag moves correctly-- backwards only! That said I didn't take it completely apart and although it seems to spin freely now that wasn't the case under pressure I had a hell of a time getting the starter out BEFORE I pulled the flywheel. The price on them is 85.00 and my local dealer does have them in stock, so we'll see

The part I'm lest impressed with is the starter. I know others have commented on it but that things really looks and feel like a POS. I took it apart and will clean up the brushed and what not but the tip spins but feel very notchy.

OK enough talking here some pics.

Forgot this one last pictures.

Flogged out ring gear.
Hope it all works.

So this am I pulled the worm gear out and also pulled the cover off the srag/clutch that the starter gear rides in. I was told that a good sign the sprag is shot is if you hear the starter engage when you kick. Another sure sign is when your pulling the stater worm gear out if you can rotate the the sprang clockwise (it freewheels clockwise and engages counterclockwise) and it won't turn to allow the worm to disengage.

I've for sure herd the starter engage when I kick and did have some trouble spinning it to remove the worm gear. That said with the flywheel and other parts removed. If I sandwich them together out of the bike in hand the sprag seems to work as intended. So I'm wondering if this is due to a lack of torx ie not installed or if it's good to go. My dealer does have them in stock but it's a haul to get to him and I was hopping to get this bike together by Saturday.

If anyone has any thoughts I'd be interested. the 84.00 for new one stings but I'm not interested in pulling this apart next week.

Joe