• 4 Stroke Husqvarna Motorcycles Made In Italy - About 1989 to 2014
    TE = 4st Enduro & TC = 4st Cross

  • Hi everyone,

    As you all know, Coffee (Dean) passed away a couple of years ago. I am Dean's ex-wife's husband and happen to have spent my career in tech. Over the years, I occasionally helped Dean with various tech issues.

    When he passed, I worked with his kids to gather the necessary credentials to keep this site running. Since then (and for however long they worked with Coffee), Woodschick and Dirtdame have been maintaining the site and covering the costs. Without their hard work and financial support, CafeHusky would have been lost.

    Over the past couple of weeks, I’ve been working to migrate the site to a free cloud compute instance so that Woodschick and Dirtdame no longer have to fund it. At the same time, I’ve updated the site to a current version of XenForo (the discussion software it runs on). The previous version was outdated and no longer supported.

    Unfortunately, the new software version doesn’t support importing the old site’s styles, so for now, you’ll see the XenForo default style. This may change over time.

    Coffee didn’t document the work he did on the site, so I’ve been digging through the old setup to understand how everything was running. There may still be things I’ve missed. One known issue is that email functionality is not yet working on the new site, but I hope to resolve this over time.

    Thanks for your patience and support!

Motorcycle Oils vs. Automotive Oils

Tinken

Husqvarna
Pro Class
Motorcycle Oils vs. Automotive Oils

I stumbled across an interesting article written by Ducati Meccanica. I think of all the arguments concerning the subject of oil, none out weight the controversial argument of using Automotive versus Motorcycle specific oil. I cut and pasted some bits of the article below, but I do recommend reading more of the article, especially the tests near the bottom of the page.
:popcorn:

http://www.ducatimeccanica.com/oil.html

Walk into any motorcycle dealership parts department and you are virtually guaranteed to see prominent displays of oils produced specifically for use in motorcycle engines. Since dealers are not about to waste valuable floor or counter space on a product unless it produces a decent profit, it is obvious that motorcycle-specific oils have become one of the premier parts department cash cows of the 1990s.


Many motorcyclists have long doubted the need to pay the inflated prices asked for most motorcycle-specific engine oils. An even larger number of us have harbored at least some degree of skepticism about the claims made for motorcycle oils, but have been reluctant to turn away from them, for fear of damaging our precious machines if the claims should happen to be true. Most of this fear comes from very successful marketing campaigns mounted by the manufacturers and distributors of motorcycle-specific lubricants.


The idea, of course, is not so much to educate as to frighten the customer into paying for the more expensive motorcycle oil that only guess-who sells. Such techniques have played on our fears with great effect, to the point where high-priced, motorcycle-specific lubricants have become staple profit producing items in the majority of motorcycle dealership parts departments throughout the country.


What we, as well as the AMI, your local mechanic and all the other motorcycling publications have been doing is simply repeating what we have been carefully taught to believe over the years. The only problem with this approach is that our only source of information has been the people who stand to profit from our faith in the superiority of motorcycle-specific oils.

Bottom Line

It could appear from this data, then, that there is no validity to the constantly-used argument that motorcycle-specific oils provide superior lubrication to automotive oils when used in a motorcycle. If the viscosity drop is the only criterion, then there is certainly no reason to spend the extra money on oil specifically designed for motorcycles. There does, however, appear to be a legitimate argument for using synthetic and synthetic-blend oils over the petroleum based products.


viscosity.jpg
 
Interesting stuff.
Wonder why he used 15w50 Mobil1 when the others are 10w40?
Also note that no mention is made about clutch slippage with car oil...
I don't know if this is myth or fact...

I googled Prof Woolum and see he left Cal State in 2006.
No date on the MCN story as quoted by Ducati.
So I went to the MCN website and could not find said article... But there is reference to it from 2004, so it happened prior to that.
 
Automotive racing oils contain a friction modifier called molybdenum disulphide. This is extremely bad for motorcycle wet clutches and should be avoided.

The friction modifiers in regular automotive oils is Zinc dialkyldithiophosphates, commonly referred to as ZDDP. This is the same friction modifier used in motorcycle specific engine oils. Because ZDDP is harmful to emission catalytic converters, the quanity of ZDDP is reduced in automotive oils due to government limitations, zddp is slightly higher motorcycle specific oils. That being said, there is a higher chance of wet clutch slippage using motorcycle oils than with automotive.

Claim - Since the introduction of catalytic converters in utomobiles, the best anti-wear agents have been limited by law to the amount that an be used in automotive oils, but are present in greater concentration in motorcycle oils.
Fact - Phosphorous deteriorates the catalyst in converters and is therefore restricted to a very small percentage in automotive oils. Phosphorous is also an essential element in one of the best anti-wear agents, ZDDP (zinc dialkyldithiophosphate), which is a primary component of such over-the-counter engine additives as STP Engine Treatment.
While it is true that slightly increased concentrations of ZDDP are found in some motorcycle oils (such as Spectro products), it is also true that these concentrations still fall under the governmental limits, otherwise these oils could not be used in the new converter-equipped motorcycles from BMW and Yamaha. Also, it should be noted that ZDDP is a "last line of defense"-type additive, generally only coming into play under extremely severe conditions where actual metal-to-metal contact occurs within an engine, something that should never happen under normal operating conditions.

I found the Mobil1 interesting as well. That particular formulation of Mobil1 is outstanding, but doesn't seem like a fair comparison. Maybe Mobil1 10w40 was unavailable at the time of testing? I will have to track down the research as you did and try to find out why.

I did find an additional listing of the article here:
http://www.nightrider.com/biketech/oiltest1.htm
 
You are correct. I have to run a zinc additive oil or supplement in my 70 gto engine.

Just can't throw the new oils in.
 
Oil is just oil ... dino or man made ... After you get past the multi-grade properties, its all just slippery oil .... Then an additive package and a brand name is added and the oil becomes the greatest oil of all time ... I'll stay with some version of true synthetic stuff for the 4t machines ...
 
It hasn't because there hasn't been sufficient numbers who have read it. I imagine that there will always be the a hand full of lemmings who will continue over the cliff. But the majority of readers will catch on eventually.
 
Not sure if all this is true or not, but it does illustrate why a person must educate themselves or the world will prey upon you at ~every corner ...
 
Motorcycle Oils vs. Automotive Oils
http://www.ducatimeccanica.com/oil.html
The campaigns promoting motorcycle-specific oils have successfully indoctrinated an entire Generation of motorcycle riders and mechanics.
When I was in my teens and first started maintaining my own car, it was said that you HAD to change your oil every 3000 miles, I didn't do that then either and I never had a oil related engine problem. Indoctrination happens all the time in all walks of life.

I have a personal experience with a so called "auto oil", Mobil1 15w50, this oil kept my TE450 from seizing up when the rads were run dry (Scott Summers recounts a similar occurence on a 510) and I unknowingly rode 50 miles home at 65 mph, the high heat incident damaged some rubber parts, but the engine has been running great for almost 5000 miles since that high heat incident. I am using this type of oil in all my water cooled bikes now, and will always use an oil similar to this one.
 
Hi, my name is Kelly, I use off the shelf "car" motor oil in my bikes. Always have on MANY bikes. No issues.

- IMHO all oil is at a high standard now. Just use the cheaper stuff and change it a lot as wet clutches and how we use our bikes (hard but infrequent and in very nasty conditions) makes it break down and get contaminated quicker.
 
I agree Kelly. I change my 511's oil every 300 miles with Rotella T. The 511 is my 18th bike and I have never had a lubrication related issue with any of my bikes and I always use Rotella.
 
I agree Kelly. I change my 511's oil every 300 miles with Rotella T. The 511 is my 18th bike and I have never had a lubrication related issue with any of my bikes and I always use Rotella.

So what is the first rotella you used and what year?
 
Hi, my name is Kelly, I use off the shelf "car" motor oil in my bikes. Always have on MANY bikes. No issues.

- IMHO all oil is at a high standard now. Just use the cheaper stuff and change it a lot as wet clutches and how we use our bikes (hard but infrequent and in very nasty conditions) makes it break down and get contaminated quicker.

Hi Kelly, Welcome to Regular Oil User Anonymous. Admitting your usage is the first step...
 
I have an '89 CB-1 (400cc street bike derived from the Japan-only CBR400RR). I got it as a student in 1990, couldn't afford anything other than generic oil from whatever big box store was in the neighborhood. Other than checking to make sure the oil met the basic standards specified in the owners manual, I never, ever put m/c specific oil in it. Bike is very high reving for it's day, and spent a LOT of time bumping off the rev limiter, over 50,000km on the road and some track days, never had the slightest problem. Runs awesome to this day, no rebuilds, no issues.

Same applied to the 50,000km I put on an EX500 before that, and the VTR250 my wife rides now, never any problems.

That said, I do run the most expensive synthetic my local m/c shop carries in my TE310, but then it holds so little oil it's pretty cheap peace of mind.
 
I have a personal experience with a so called "auto oil", Mobil1 15w50, this oil kept my TE450 from seizing up when the rads were run dry (Scott Summers recounts a similar occurence on a 510) and I unknowingly rode 50 miles home at 65 mph, the high heat incident damaged some rubber parts, but the engine has been running great for almost 5000 miles since that high heat incident. I am using this type of oil in all my water cooled bikes now, and will always use an oil similar to this one.
OlderHuskyRider -
I found something interesting you might enjoy. I remembered your story when I came across a video on youtube. In the video Ray McDonald and Doug Deckman, both engineers and formulators for Mobil1, both claim that there is so much performance reserve in Mobil1, that it will still protect your engine even if your cooling system goes out and keep it in "functional condition" until you can get it serviced. At the time I kind of laughed it off because that's a pretty big claim, but then I remembered your story.


 
I had a Jeep Cherokee straight6 that had 160ks on it & lost a rad hose on I95 here in FL. I had Mobil1 in it for years and was close to my exit so kept on driving. Just as I got off the exit it got so hot it just shut off. Let it cool down while I walked to get a new hose. Started it up, no noises no smoke, drove it for another 40k miles no trouble. But I do use synthetic moto oil in the bikes. Most new 4st are going to separate crankcase & gearboxes so clutches aren't running in engine oil.
 
Back
Top