Question about 83 WR430

[dukkman]

Hi
Did the 83/Wr430 come out with a CR front end in America ?

Mate has one here in Australia [ American import ] with CR forks and tripple trees which makes the steering a lot faster than a 85/Wr 400 and is a pain in the trickey stuff.

 

[Kartwheel68]

In '83 the only difference between CR and WR forks was the damper rod and springs, everything else was the same including triple clamps.

 

[hva-factory]

The fork bottoms were the longer MX versions and the chrome tubes were 750m/m long instead of the 715m/m Enduro stanchions....

The fork stops were also longer on the XC thus less steering lock.

Andy Elliott.

 

[Kartwheel68]

'84 was the first year the fork upper and lower tubes were different on the WR, '81-'83 they were the same on all models, only the damper rod and spring were different.

 

[suprize]

XC always had CR suspension... motocrosser with 6 speeds and lights

 

[dukkman]

Not a XC Surprize , frame no says WR.
Has what looks like CR tripple trees with rubber mounted pull back handle bar mounts [ handle bars end up behind the centre tube where as the 85's are in front ] and the distance between the centre tube and the fork tubes looks to be less than my 85.
My 85 handles the uphill narly rocky knobby stuff so easy it's silly [ just point and go ].
Mates 83 [ first one in my avatar photo ] sort of has a mind of it's own.
He's been wingeing about it for a while so I took it for a spin and yep it's very different.
It has heaps of power but steering is real sus.
Looks to Have WR fork tubes.
Will post a photo.

 

[firecrackerkid]

Pics are a big help. Here are a few for reference. Shorter is WR forks.

 

[suprize]

Dont forget that most WR huskys got a suspension upgrade for whatever reason in aus and usually with whatever was lying around in the shop. The tracks weren't as snotty as Europe and aus wasnt crippled with the FIM 10.5" maximum travel restriction. so most wr owners found a set of xc or cr fork sliders / damper rods and pulled the spacer out of the Ohlins. looks like your mates had the whole front end grafted on

We did ol mates 510 TE for the Mallee Desert rally and i think it was still in that form when it was sold.

 

[Kartwheel68]

Not a XC Surprize , frame no says WR.
Has what looks like CR tripple trees with rubber mounted pull back handle bar mounts [ handle bars end up behind the centre tube where as the 85's are in front ] and the distance between the centre tube and the fork tubes looks to be less than my 85.
My 85 handles the uphill narly rocky knobby stuff so easy it's silly [ just point and go ].
Mates 83 [ first one in my avatar photo ] sort of has a mind of it's own.
He's been wingeing about it for a while so I took it for a spin and yep it's very different.
It has heaps of power but steering is real sus.
Looks to Have WR fork tubes.
Will post a photo.

The '81-'83s all had the set back handlebar mounts, that is not an indication it has CR parts.

 

[dukkman]

Right guys here's the photo's.
Surprize this bike is a direct import out of USA.
The bike

Top tripple with pull back mounts


Now another set of the same tripple's with straight up clamps

And from above . Note that if you put a ruler across the bottom of the fork tube holes then it looks to line up with the main stem tube hole at the bottom.



Now my 85 [ below ] and as you can see [ although not well ] if you were to put the same ruler across the 3 holes they would NOT line up. The 85 looks to have the fork tubes further forward which would slow the steering down I think.
Also note that the handle bars are now forward of the head stem.

His overall fork leg measurement is 1015mm [ he has a spare set of 40mm that measure 1063mm ] and mine is 1000mm.
The distance from the bottom of the fork slider to the axle centre not including the damper nut.
His 115mm , mine 75mm
I just don't understand how the steering can be so different unless it has something to do with the difference in power delivery or the fork tube offset has a big effect because his longer forks should increase the rake and slow everything down.

The extra things on my handle bars are the leftovers from a set of barkbusters and I will take them off one day.

 

[suprize]

The laid back specials look like they would suit a desert sled...those early huskies were still desert orientated with slow steering and raked headsets for the US market. 84 was the first year to look at tighter slower steering after the land in the USA started to be locked up and their principal market changed to tight muddy euro events again.

 

[Kartwheel68]

The '83 came with those rear set bar mounts, those look like stock '83 mounts and clamps to me. The '82 mounts and triple clamps were identical to the '83, I will go take some pictures of my '82 430WR and '83 175WR clamps and post them in a bit. One thing I see right away, the fork tubes should not be flush, you need to drop the clamps down as far as you can without the wheel hitting the fender and full compression. No loss of high speed stability and massive improvement in turning.

 

[Ron]

I've ridden my bike (77 250CR, 29 deg rake) with pulled back clamps and forward clamps.
Personally I like the pulled back clamps.
Cornering is not much different, but the front end feels lighter with the pulled back clamps.
Forward clamps make the front end feel heavy over straight line whoops.
But then I am an old desert racer.

 

[Kartwheel68]

My '82 430WR:

See how far I have the tubes above the top clamp? If you have them flush like the bike you have there, it will handle like a dump truck full of bowling balls with two flat front tires. Slide the clamps down as far as you can and the bike will turn on a dime.

My '83 175WR, the forks are not the originals, they are from another bike just so I can roll it around.

That bike is a totally stock '83 430WR, those triple clamps and forks are stock. The straight bar mount came after '83, not sure of the year, but I do know 100% for certain that '84 was the first year that the WR had different fork lowers. The '81-'83 had the same upper and lower tubes, the WR just had a shorter damper rod.

I bought my bike from the original owner about 6 months ago, it is 100% stock, you can see it has the longer underhang fork lowers.

 

[dukkman]

Now we're getting some where.
Thanks Kart and Ron.
I will drop the forks through the clamps and see what happens.
Cheers

 

[Kartwheel68]

I should have measured the distance from the top of the tube to the top clamp so you know how much to drop the clamps. I will do that first thing tomorrow morning, but I think it was around 10mm. That small of an amount doesnt seem like it would make much difference, but it really does.

 

[husqyhamm]

Lowering or extending forks tubes in triple clamps make a huge difference. Even as little as 2mm can fine tune steering characteristics for a specific condition.

Generally you have 2 types of triples, the ones with casting no 1512 357 are for the twinshockers 82-84, with the single-shockers having a different steering stock angle and its own triples as per photos on this thread. Ive also seen one strange pair of triples halfaway between twin and single shockers but it had no numbers to id.
Have used single shock triples on aircooled bikes with 30 degree headstock and worked well specifically over high speed heavily whooped riverbed conditions.
I found the twinshock Huskies are very tyre type and pressure sensitive thus a balance between this, fork tube position, preload, airgap, oil viscosity all forms a very big playground for trial and error. Select your tyre according to the terrain you ride and then work with the rest.
Also the swept-back bar clamps don't work for me in either single or twinshock. Straight clamps.

 

[Picklito]

My '82 430WR:
The straight bar mount came after '83, not sure of the year, but I do know 100% for certain that '84 was the first year that the WR had different fork lowers. The '81-'83 had the same upper and lower tubes, the WR just had a shorter damper rod.

This matches my own info. I once wrote this down for some reason:

1. 81 WR had 35mm forks
2. 81 CR/XC and 82 CR/XC/WR had 40mm forks and long underhang. 82 WR's had a shorter damper rod.
3. 83 CR/XC/WR had 40mm forks and long underhang. WR had shorter damper rod.
4. 84 CR/XC had long underhang.
5. 84 WR had short underhang.

 

[Picklito]

Have used single shock triples on aircooled bikes with 30 degree headstock and worked well specifically over high speed heavily whooped riverbed conditions.

Me too! The later single-shock triples have more offset, so less trail. The feel in the bars becomes much lighter. There is less "over center drop" when rolling the bike around. It's a good mod to try on the 30-degree air cooled bikes. You can mix and match the set-back or straight-up bar clamps to get whatever bar position you like.

The only downside of the single shock triples... they have solid mounted bar clamps. My hands like the rubber mounts!

 

[Kartwheel68]

This matches my own info. I once wrote this down for some reason:

1. 81 WR had 35mm forks
2. 81 CR/XC and 82 CR/XC/WR had 40mm forks and long underhang. 82 WR's had a shorter damper rod.
3. 83 CR/XC/WR had 40mm forks and long underhang. WR had shorter damper rod.
4. 84 CR/XC had long underhang.
5. 84 WR had short underhang.

Half way through '81 the 430WR got 40mm forks.