The Dreaded Slave Cylinder...C-Clip?

[2wheellove]

First, let me start off by saying that I purchased this bike a little over a year ago used...and it has been an uphill battle ever since. Knowing what I know now, I would of walked away from this bike altogether...

So, I recently pulled the slave cylinder on my TE310 and found the classic chipped slave housing. The piston o ring was also pretty warn. Surprisingly, the bore didnt seem that bad, despite the chipped portion at the bottom. Either way, I went ahead and purchased the 7602 piston and the zipty racing cylinder and was going to install it this weekend when I realized that the old slave was missing the C-Clip. I checked the parts manuals and I didn't see it in there either which is confusing to me....

Is it possible that my 09' TE310 isn't supposed to have the C-clip? I tried searching and I didn't come up with an obvious answer. And even if I am supposed to have one, there doesn't seem to be a part number in the parts manual which means I am just going to have to measure the bore and find something at a local parts store....not ideal but I am sure I can find something that will work.

I also checked the clutch push rod which seems to be fine...no obvious signs of significant wear. Could someone tell me what the measurements are supposed to be?

My thoughts are this...the PO rebuilt the slave, replaced the pushrod, and put everything back together without the C-Clip because the lip was broken...but then again, this is all speculation. lol

 

[OlderHuskyRider]

Supposed to be a snap ring in there

 

[2wheellove]

Supposed to be a snap ring in there

Then why is it not listed in the parts or repair manual? It just seems odd to me that they wouldn't put it in there.

 

[268fords]

That is weird it's not in the diagram. It keeps the piston from falling out, deffinately should have one.

 

[2wheellove]

That is weird it's not in the diagram. It keeps the piston from falling out, deffinately should have one.

Well i guess its not absolutely needed because mine hasn't had for god knows how long lol

I mean, the piston can only go so far right? My guess is, the snap ring is whats causing all the housings to crack. When the push rod wears and gets short enough, the piston bottoms out on the snap ring and eventually cracks the housing. This is also why people have been having this "hard to get into neutral" business...because the push rod is too short. Speaking of...does anyone have the dimensions for the push rod? I would like to check mine before I put it all back together and bleed it.

 

[waserman]

I don't have the dimensions of the push rod , but the chipped or broken slave cylinder is usually the result of someone operating the clutch lever without it being installed in the engine case . Because there is nothing to limit the travel of the piston in the bore of the slave cylinder , and it will push right out against the c-clip and break the casting when it's not installed and pushing on the clutch rod . You should have one in there . I have been trying to source one from Zip Ty since the beginning of December , and thought he had actually located one for me 2 weeks ago, after talking to one of his people on the phone , never got anything . This was after I had done the same purchases as you , Zip Ty Racing slave and 7602 piston and quad ring . They were Magura clutch components but I haven't been able to find them on their web-site . They must have been one of builds for Husqvarna . My next move is to take this slave cylinder and measure the bore and then go to the hardware store and try to find the proper internal c-clip . I just don't know when I'm going to get around to it .

 

[2wheellove]

I don't have the dimensions of the push rod , but the chipped or broken slave cylinder is usually the result of someone operating the clutch lever without it being installed in the engine case . Because there is nothing to limit the travel of the piston in the bore of the slave cylinder , and it will push right out against the c-clip and break the casting when it's not installed and pushing on the clutch rod . You should have one in there . I have been trying to source one from Zip Ty since the beginning of December , and thought he had actually located one for me 2 weeks ago, after talking to one of his people on the phone , never got anything . This was after I had done the same purchases as you , Zip Ty Racing slave and 7602 piston and quad ring . They were Magura clutch components but I haven't been able to find them on their web-site . They must have been one of builds for Husqvarna . My next move is to take this slave cylinder and measure the bore and then go to the hardware store and try to find the proper internal c-clip . I just don't know when I'm going to get around to it .

Yah, ive heard this theory...but to me...it just doesn't make any sense. Why would people operate the clutch with the slave out of the bike?

And most people that have reported this issue, have never even pulled the slave apart before they found the broken cylinder. This is not to say that it hasn't happened before..but I don't think its the real cause. I think the real cause is the shortening of the clutch rod, which is supposed to act as a physical stop for the slave. If the rod gets to warn/short, the cylinder can extend much farther up against the C-clip and bang...

here is an older thread for some of the older bikes that had the same issues: http://www.thumpertalk.com/topic/436689-04-250450-clutch-control-rod-observation/

 

[Colo moto]

Yah, ive heard this theory...but to me...it just doesn't make any sense. Why would people operate the clutch with the slave out of the bike?

I think 90% of the time it is an accident. You've got the slave pulled off, buddy comes over to help drink beer while you fix your bike. He gives the handlebars a wiggle, gives the levers a squeeze and pop goes the slave cylinder.

 

[2wheellove]

I think 90% of the time it is an accident. You've got the slave pulled off, buddy comes over to help drink beer while you fix your bike. He gives the handlebars a wiggle, gives the levers a squeeze and pop goes the slave cylinder.

lol with friends like that....

wait are you saying that 90% of the time, the failures were related to people just coming up squeezing it....or that 90% of the time that sort of failure happens, its an accident? lol

...quite a number of people have reported finding this issue after opening this slave for the first time....so that right there tells ya something. Not to mention that this problem seems to go back quite a ways.

 

[rancher1]

I am going to have to agree with Colo on this most of the broken housings occur when the slave is off the motor. George from uptite has also commented several times about the snap ring being unnecessary for operation as you have already proved. Sounds like it is time to put it together and ride.

 

[jmetteer]

I broke mine when the engine was out for crank bearings, you may be surprised how automatic it is to pull in the clutch when you touch the bars. I ran the OEM slave for another year with no clip before it started slowly leaking. Now I have the zipty slave and 7602 piston with the clip back in, it has a touch heavier pull but works nicely.

Later,

 

[waserman]

I've been riding bikes for more than 45 years and have never replaced the clutch rod in any of them are you telling me that Husqvarna didn't heat treat this part knowing that there would be metal to metal contact ? If that's the case there should have been a recall especially since the Te models were street legal for several years and that should have been a safety issue since you possibly couldn't disengage the clutch when approaching traffic .

 

[Trenchcoat85]

Yah, ive heard this theory...but to me...it just doesn't make any sense. Why would people operate the clutch with the slave out of the bike?

Hmmmm- "...doesn't make any sense"? I'm not sure how long you've been riding, but in my 48 years of experience, I have enough trouble suppressing my own instinct to pull in the clutch OR brake lever when I know I shouldn't (to the degree of removing or blocking a lever when working on the brakes, for instance).

Friends that come into my garage do the same thing. It's the first thing I do to a strange bike also. Put a bag, at least, over the bar-end to remind you and your buddies not to touch. You will be dollars ahead.

Hell, on my street bikes, STRANGERS pull on the levers when they're parked in public (well- on my Shovelhead, the clutch takes 2 men & a small boy.... but still- they try) and even sit on 'em w/o permission (t'weener boys mostly). it's weird.

Also- your circlip/e-clip/snap-ring may not be detailed in the parts manual because Husky (or Magura or Brembo) considers it a complete assembly. Don't know about the service manual.

I've never seen a clutch pushrod w/o a ball end or bearing either.... OTOH, my frikken memory seems to be fading fast. My 310 is my first hydraulic clutch (I'm not a fan of, either) but I've worked on plenty of my kid's KTMs.

 

[2wheellove]

I've been riding bikes for more than 45 years and have never replaced the clutch rod in any of them are you telling me that Husqvarna didn't heat treat this part knowing that there would be metal to metal contact ? If that's the case there should have been a recall especially since the Te models were street legal for several years and that should have been a safety issue since you possibly couldn't disengage the clutch when approaching traffic .

There have been a few cases that I have seen that talk about the clutch rod wearing. However, I don't think they wear to the point of locking up the clutch completely. At most I think its the reason for a pretty noticeable clutch drag...but I wouldn't say complete failure. It usually takes a while and you would notice it well before it could cause a serious accident or something like that.

Also, if you look at the rod in the picture I posted above, you can see that both ends are not the same. While the clutch side seems to be bare aluminum, I think the other end could possibly be steal...I haven't taken a magnet to it or anything but I think it is. The side with the steal is up against the piston bearing...which would make sense from a design standpoint. Now, with that being said, there are many cases like this that have metal to metal contact, they use dissimilar metals on purpose to ensure that one wears and the other doesn't.

The biggest example of this that I can think of is the shift plate for the ratchet mechanism. The plate is made from mild steal and the rachet mech that rides inside the plate is made from a harder material....eventual, a burr develops in the shift plate which can lead to notchy shifts and issues with finding neutral when the bike is hot. I think the reason for this is to protect the trans but I am not sure....

 

[Bugsinteeth]

I can't remember the measurements.....but I did change the clutch pushrod on my high mileage 2005 TE one time. It was significantly mushroomed on the end (internal end) as pictured in the third photo from the top . I was surprised how much longer the new part was.

Simple to check and worth doing as the shortened rod has been targeted as potentially damaging the much more expensive to replace slave cylinder. I think the new rod was only 10 or 15 bucks.

Cheers,

Bugs

 

[2wheellove]

I can't remember the measurements.....but I did change the clutch pushrod on my high mileage 2005 TE one time. It was significantly mushroomed on the end (internal end) as pictured in the third photo from the top . I was surprised how much longer the new part was.

Simple to check and worth doing as the shortened rod has been targeted as potentially damaging the much more expensive to replace slave cylinder. I think the new rod was only 10 or 15 bucks.

Cheers,

Bugs

Bugs,

Thanks for the reply! Are you saying that my clutch rod looks like yours did? I didn't think mine looked like there were any obvious signs of damage or deformation, but then again I don't know what they look like new. Do you think I should replace mine?

Dan

 

[Bugsinteeth]

Dan,

My brain is a little rusty and the bike is long gone.....but from what I remember....the rod as seen in your picture (internal end) looks as new. My old one looked mushroomed on the end or kinda like a bulb of garlic. When I lined it up against the new one I was quite surprised how much shorter it was.....I'm guessing about 1/16 to 1/8 of an inch. Which doesn't sound like much, but, for a machined internal engine part it was enough for me to change it.

Just as a reference:

I put Uptite George's X ring seal on the stock slave piston/cylinder early on in the bikes life. Slave worked well for about 12 000km/many years. At the 12k point the clutch resivoir started to loose fluid so I checked the rod (shortened) and the cylinder wall (just a tiny little spot where the anodize had warn off.....changed the rod and a new George X ring but no dice...... before long leakage returned, until I changed the cylinder for an OEM used one that worked fine.

Good luck!

Bugs

 

[Bugsinteeth]

Dan,

to answer the second part of your question" should I replace rod". If you've gone ahead and spent the dough on an aftermarket slave and piston.....I would at least buy the $ 10 -15 pushrod to protect the other expensive parts. At least compare it against the length of your old pushrod..... If not needed, you would have a spare for down the road.

I guess this step could be avoided if someone out there knows the measured length of a new OEM pushrod ???? I can't help with this as bike is gone.

Cheers,
Bugs

 

[2wheellove]

Dan,

to answer the second part of your question" should I replace rod". If you've gone ahead and spent the dough on an aftermarket slave and piston.....I would at least buy the $ 10 -15 pushrod to protect the other expensive parts. At least compare it against the length of your old pushrod..... If not needed, you would have a spare for down the road.

I guess this step could be avoided if someone out there knows the measured length of a new OEM pushrod ???? I can't help with this as bike is gone.

Cheers,
Bugs

Bugs,

Many thanks! I think I am going to just buy the rod. They are about 14$ and its worth the cheap insurance...unless someone can give me those dimensions. Either way...you have been a huge help..thank you!

Dan