OK, so now I am now beginning to understand the big picture. What will be interesting to see play out in the long run is how the relationships will be managed and how new bikes and models will emerge. Given that SP/KTM and by default Bajaj, now own Husqvarna/Husaberg, then I assume that there is no way that the above TVS/Husky/KTM hybrid bike can go forward unless it is rebranded a Bajaj/Husky/KTM hybrid. Whats more, now that BMW have signed their agreement with TVS, BMW would be in direct competition with Bajaj, hence it is why the BMW derived Husky products do not fit in. Therefore, I am speculating that perhaps a new kymco powered TVS manufactured bike might be a possibility and that we may see this relaunched for western markets as an Indian built TVS/BMW 450. So maybe the G450/TE449 platform might have a future after all under TVS? Possibilities......? http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323550604578409960656038972.html The partnership with TVS will give BMW a significant foothold in India's growing motorcycle market, the world's second biggest. It would also give the company access to TVS's plants in India The partnership could give TVS access to the technology to develop new motorcycles. It would also enable the Chennai-based company to better compete with larger local rivals such as Hero MotoCorp Ltd. 500182.BY -0.86% and Bajaj Auto Ltd.532977.BY -0.95% and foreign competitors such as Honda Motor Co.,7267.TO -1.16% Yamaha Motor Co. 7272.TO +0.37% and Suzuki Motor Corp.7269.TO -0.95% TVS now produces motorcycles with engine capacities of 110cc-180cc
At the moment all speculation but I would say due to the fact KTM have accepted responsibility for parts supply and warranty of the 449/511 engine as part of the Husqvarna purchase, they would have some rights to the BMW/KYMCO design engine and as such a say in any future bikes running this engine.
Interesting stuff.... Hopefully the huge motorcycle market in the Emerging World, will subsidize the low volume Euro dirt bikes we love and they will continue to be assembled in Europe, from mainly the Euro and Japanese parts.
Not sure if it means anything or not, but Letti was running WP suspension on his Husky today at Erzberg.
some news on the husky plant. hope its not been posted before http://translate.google.com/transla....it/bc_news/notizia.cfm?codice=412313&act=url
that "ancient" wr300 finished second place at erzberg today. congratulations, andreas lettenbichler! r
I'm still blown over by all this ... I'm used to seeing cloning or copycating on products here and bike engines ..Maybe honda is over in china giving out licenses to whoever for the cloned engines to be imported here? I just thought these chines clones were made somehow without honda input.. bmw working hand and hand with this tvs company to product cloned Huskies? And then sells Husky out to SP? All transpiring in recent months? I see it but cannot understand the legal aspects of all the data and information flowing between the 2 companies ESP after selling the company to SP ... -- MX racing or whatever you wanna called it is probably being pumped up to a new levels in these countries with affordable bikes (cloned) being produced for the masses ... I keep putting the racing here out here for you guys to see what racing around the world is doing as compared to the states ... Bike racing is part of the political process here (says alot for cash flow) , it simulates the local grassroots economy, its the best entertainment going other than basketball or volleyball ... Its the 70s here and plenty of growth is possible but everyone cannot afford a 350,000P top-of-the-line-bike to ride ... In any event, this is why these guys want the brand ... Rebadging is out here.. Cloning is in ... I just hope SP races a Husky to glory in the USA ... 1st world bikes will be made off the profits made in the developing countries selling MILs of small bikes and apparently clones... I'm just blown away with the path these large companies are taking for products ...But I do see the benefits of the crowds here loving bike racing of any size or bike brand ... Free entry to all races except on Mindanao then ~$2 a head ..
Yeh, it blows me away too. Just have a look at the Chinese made Odes bike we have in Australia. Less than half the price of a CRF yet runs the same piston and crankshaft apparently. Its a pretty decent copy if you ask me. I just don't know how the clones get away from it without some form of approval or licence from the factories. There must be some agreement with Honda. Maybe BMW & KTM figure that they had better get involved and licence the technology to clone manufacturers before it is cloned anyway. Half of something is better than all of nothing.
We get 'em from China AND Korea. Almost all are Honda clones but recently I've seen a few Kawasaki clones as well. Hell, I'd probably buy that bike for half the price of a CRF just as a loaner to friends who want to go for a ride.
As I understand it, China does not hold faithful to international patents like it does with the United States. Special labor trade treaties were signed for this between the US and China. All other countries are fair game?
those who make those cloned bikes do not have any license or agreement. those manufacturers are trying to make a business, trying to fullfil a demand. they don't have any problem with cloning anyone else's product. they believe if they clone a successful and high-quality product their product will be successful and high-quality, too. in fact there's not much that you can protect here. patents do not apply there, and going to court over a "similar-looking" product is a pain. i guess, honda does not even have a huge problem to be everybody's "inspiration" here. after all, those clones make honda THE standard technology in those markets, and people sooner or later will want "the original". r p.s. i found some pictures of the tvs, with a red cylinder head (picture no 3): http://www.drivespark.com/two-wheel...xtreme-sports-exclusive-interview-003661.html
I was keen to know how much these bikes sell for in India. I dug up an action video but no pricing... I posted a new thread to avoid diverting this very focused thread to off-topicsville. http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/in...-motor-company-rtr-250-fx-action-video.33365/
China will clone anything they can make a buck on. I saw a TV show where they cloned the BMW X5. BMW tried to take it to court but the Chinese goverment said no go it's a differnent car; no copy. LOL other than the name and of course the quality they looked exactly the same. I wouldn't buy a chinese bike for a quarter the cost of a euro or Japanese bike. Are some of them getting better...I guess but not good enough IMHO. Seems like they like to copy BMW cars and bike.
Giovanni has stated he is open to taking over the Husky factory, subject to striking a deal with SP and with Government support. Lets see where this goes. http://www.laprovinciadivarese.it/stories/Economia/379834_husqvarna_castiglioni/ Husqvarna,Castiglioniinfield "I might be interested in the site» June 1, 2013 Economics Husqvarna workers protest (Photo by Varese Press) BIANDRONNO "I've been thinking a lot about the case Husqvarna and if there was a viable package with all the sustainable conditions, economic, financial, trade union and ministerial, I might be interested in the site Cassinetta." Giovanni Castiglioni patron of Mv Agusta, a glimpse of the future of the plant Husqvarna, the new ownership, represented by the group Pierer and Ktm, close to transfer everything in Austria. To give a future to the site and find some Cassinetta entrepreneur concerned, there is three months long, so long will the ordinary fund that game Monday, June 3, for 212 employees. "Given that I have spoken to anyone about anything - goes Castiglioni - under certain conditions, this possibility could be explored." "If you ask me if I need it now more than 200 employees in an establishment or my answer is no - says Castiglioni - but if there is a large industrial plan, with the support of different entities of the State and of course with the 'current ownership, which must do its part, could evaluate to take this risk. " The Province of Varese on newsstands today Saturday, June 1 other details on the matter
imagine you are in the air looking at where you will land, concentrating on your line after this not the best time to wonder if the frame can take this
I have been wondering if a lower cost enduro bike would get more people in the woods, and my conclusion is no. There are plenty of used KTM's, Hondas, and yamahas for $1500-$2000, we live in a different culture where most kids would rather play with their phone. Guys that want to ride are willing to pay for quality bikes.
Maybe if we had woods. I would rather ride than Xbox, but kids are lazy these days, especially those lazy Americans... Guys that want to ride Husky's are not lame.
Nobody has offered lower cost enduro bikes that are reasonable quality, for one thing. Most of the cheap dirt bikes offered for sale right now are just that....CHEAP. And I mean little wheels, bad suspension, plastic engine covers, gutless motors, questionable carburetors CHEAP. Pep Boys used to sell little dirt bikes and quads for really cheap, but they didn't do it for very long. The machines performed poorly, had terrible parts....which were not available if the customer broke any of them....which they did, and often. I would think that somebody could offer acceptable performing full sized trail bikes with technology from the last ten years that would be reasonably reliable units, and at a reasonable price....maybe a couple thousand dollars less than the top shelf machines. Look at all the people that will buy a brand new DRZ400, and those things are certainly not state of the art. Yet PLENTY of people are willing to shell out 6500 dollars for one of those! Our local dualsport club is loaded with DRZ400 owners. Those who spend a lot of time in the dirt, eventually tire of the slow and heavy bikes and purchase a Euro enduro. But the plain old boat anchor is what they start out on. These are the kind of people who would spend 4 0r 5 grand on a clone that had some quality control going for it.
The new and used TTR225 and CRF230 are the staple for that market around here. They arent state of the art, but they get people a reasonable way to try out dirt riding..from there they either upgrade or just sell it...repeat and rinse.
You can get a new WR300 for less than $6,500 that will vastly outperform a DRZ400 (and probably make the average DRZ400 rider crap themselves in the process).
