125-200cc Uptite 167

That cylinder looks like it has more than a few pits in it. Is that for real, or is it just dust of some kind?

Dying to get another opinion on the 167.

just dust.... needless to say I am thrilled and thanks to Walt for coming down to do the install It's still not broken in and riding is getting scarce with Honeydo season starting up around here..

My impression is bottom everywhere and lugabillity i never had before.. very 4 stroke like. I've gone up from my 12T CS back to the stock 13 and put a richer pilot in it per Walt's suggestion.

My jetting info is:

ride 2600 to 6000 ft

Keihin PWK

Pilot 42

Needle EEK 4th slot

Main 185.


I really haven't gotten on the pipe yet but the above setting at 2600 to 3000 seems to be fine with the 180 main...

Kevin

Great!

Keep us posted!

I am currently out of town at a turf seminar. I have much to relate but need to do some testing to see if I can replicate Kevin's awsome powerband. I should have a typically long winded report for anyone interested this weekend. I put Kevin's motor through some short full rpm runs after we had it running for a significant number of heat cycles. I now have complete and total motor envy.

Yes Walt I am very interested. I await for your full report and thanks.

Walt,

That's a good one!

In other words you said you are at a turf seminar but we all know you are fixing the 167 roosts in Kevin's yard before Mrs Kevin gets home.

When you get done sodding his yard, we can't wait to hear your report?

My 167 is the bomb!!! I installed the CR ignition off the 09 CR125 that Bill's is parting out. Damn but the ignition curve on the Digital CDI is a revalation compared to the analog manual advance in the WR. Husky can't change to the digital ignitions on the WR's soon enough. Where a perfectly jetted WR will have a soft spot before the power valves open, the CR ignition just delivers ever more progressive mid-range power. The timing curve on the 08 and newer CR's isn't as mid-range friendly as the 04 map. Kevin's motor whether as a 125 or 167 had this wonderful mid-range bulge leading into the ripping top. The 09 map just doesn't have as much mid-range advance programmed in as the 04. Probably to take advantage of a better breathing transfer port configuration on the later cylinders. I have also gotten a dual map JD controller from FBF(on sale for $99) and will be loading the bottom/mid map as well as the normal 04 map. I just can't express how much fun the 167 is compared to the 144. I actually have to be prepared for the torque rather than being able to wick it carte blanche in almost all situations. I have more to add and will as always be fiddling more.

Yea Wally, the ignition is a must. I agree with you on the low/mid with the 09cr curve. The engine still seems a little lazy down low even with less flywheel effect from the CR setup. I do not have my 144 installed yet(have had it three weeks) but need to get moving; the 167 makes me wish I had gone the way instead.

Id like to hear another report from Kevin - on the 167
Does the bigger piston take away from the top end fun ? - I know it makes more power and torque and is easier to ride but does it feel as much fun as the 144?
I am on the fence about 144 or 167 -
GSXR - If you were regretting the 144 kit I may be interested in a trade + difference with my 7 transfer port cylinder and power valves

One thing that needs to be said, I loved my 167 before I swapped ignitions. It has enough extra torque and HP that it made the soft spot more of a non issue. It is just so much more seamless a delivery now that it has a little more advance in the soft area. I always thought the WR ran better with some more advance dialed in and it makes sense now. The problem with the manual advance is that when you adjust it manually you are giving something up somewhere else. Ajaxauto has been telling us this for years and I didn't accept it until I was finally hit over the head with the proverbial sledge hammer. An 04 CR167 that shouldn't run as well as mine(I have secrets too) that made me giddy in the mid-range. Mine had a little more snap right off idle and if anything I prefered Kevin's very controllable bottom. Once the PV's open they are very similar and just flat rip.

Another point is that Husqvarna no longer produces the 04 CDI. They have superseeded the number to a later CDI and I am willing to bet the map is changed. Husky just needs to join the rest of the their competors and make the dual map programmable CDI available on all their models. Not everyone wants the same thing kind of response.

Rockdancer,

The 167 signs off earlier than the 144. If you spend a lot of your time with it wicked and need the over rev then the 167 will disapoint you. Where the 144 will rev to 11000 effortlessly with anger, the 167 will pull harder but lose steam once it gets much over 10000. My guess is that the 167 over bore on a 125 crankcase and cylinder leads to some ineffiencies at higher rpms. The 167 is much more of a trailee/enduro motor than a long straight, wide open rip MX track.

I can't speak for Kevin, but this motor is close to perfect for his intended use. He is a trail rider. He is also much more conservative than I am and will religiously stick to George's break in instructions: 2 to 3 tanks of gas before you work the motor hard. The Mahle forged piston he uses in the kit is an amazingly hard alloy forging. It has a heat expansion rate and size that is more than in most forgings I am used to. Hope that answers some of your questions.

Thanks for the updates Walt. It sure sounds like a lot of fun to me. I just love midrange since that's where 90% of my riding is done.

Walt
That seems to be the case with the YZ as well - eg Max power- RPM say that the YZ139 rips harder and with as much power as a YZ 144 big bore without the added vibration
Its difficult to know how it suits without riding it .
The ignition is interesting though - my 06 wasn t quite as strong in the mid range as my 08 so if anything the ignition changed after 04

Another note on the 167. Because break in is lengthy, it is imperative to get the jetting right or a little rich from the low mid and higher. I learned this the hard way. I am such an idiot sometimes. This is easy with the PWK but takes a little more work with the Mikuni. The Mikuni wants the pilot to be a little smaller and the needle and main to be richer to achieve this for the 167.

Rockdancer,

That is my impression too just from looking through all the parts books. One thing I can say is that the ignition curve in Kevin's allows him to run power valve spring combinations effectively that the WR can only dream about. He runs the yellow outer spring with the green inner and I can only describe it as amazing. Wonderful low to early mid torque and rideability, strong bulging but completely controllable mid that turns into a monster at about 7500 rpms.

HEHE, my bet is that Kevin lets it rip above 8000 rpm maybe twice a year. He just won't need to. My old go pro is a $100 piece of worthless plastic so I upgraded to the new one. The audio is much better and when I get to ride again I will post a vid that will explain the 167 much better than words.

Im jealous of both of your bikes - I really like the old school 04 though

One thing I dont undertand is where Rick Peterson has said that stroking the motor kelps to increase the piston speed - rev ability I tried to explain the theory to someone but couldnt as I always thought stroking adds torque ( which it does ) but also helps it to rev. confusing .

Food for thought? I took the 06 WR125 powervalve apart and put the stock/silver spring in it. The 06 stock powervalve spring seems alot stiffer than my 09 stock spring? Sure felt like it?

Hey guys.. haven't been around, work/life is getting in the way of my riding... I agree with everything Walt said and in fact haven't ridden it other than on the street for a couple of minutes to annoy my neighbors after I put a 185 main and the 13cs back on it.

With my commitments and the weather this weekend it's not looking too good either

I will post up after my next ride (whenever that is)

Kevin

Wally, I'm not sure I understand what ignition you're running right now. It's an '09 CR ignition with the JD dual map from FBF? And it's the second map that comes with the JD that gives you the fat mid range?

I'm curious because my '08 CR (still a 125) definitely could use better mid range, and it sounds as if the JD dual map would help me out. Am I right?