1984 CR500 questions

[outboardguy]

Hello
I purchased a 1984 CR500 at a yard sale recently. I'm starting to get some things figured out on it.
When I got it it didn't have a clutch cable on it. I have since purchased and installed it, but the handle takes quite a bit of effort to pull. Is this normal? and if not where should I look to correct it? I have purchased the gasket for the kicker side of the motor and was going to head in there, but I figured I might ask you first before I get myself in too deep.

I got the bike to run when i got it. I took off the gastank and hooked up my outboard tank to the fuel line. When I pumped the carb overflowed. I didn't think much of it. My neighbor and I kicked on it for a good half hour and finally after removing the spark plug several times to verify spark it roared to life. The bike ran good,had a steady idle and revved up nice, but it appeared to be smoking from the top and bottom of the cylinder. Unfortunately I forgot that I had no steady flow of fuel , so it stalled shortly thereafter. How common is it for the base gasket to be in need of replacement? I plan on pulling the engine apart to fix and would like any pointers you might have.
I then set the bike to the side for a few days.I cleaned the gas tank and reinstalled. Filled with fuel.Opened the valve and started kicking. I noticed after a few seconds the carb overflowing. What I didn't realize was the fuel was also filling the crankcase. After several more attempts to start it over the next few days I realized what had happened and had to turn the bike upside down with the spark plug removed to get the 1/2 quart of gas out. I removed the carb and checked/ adjusted float level. When I reinstalled it and opened the fuel valve there was no overflow of fuel and after many kicks the bike started. Content with myself I walked away with the petcock open only to come back a few days later to find the tank empty. So now the crankcase is full of gas again which I will dry out later. I set the float level to 3/4 of an inch. Is this correct? I put the floats in water and they floated,but I don't know if they could still be bad. Does anybody have the weight spec on the floats and do these floats sink often?
Anyway Sorry for the long story
I appreciate any and all help
Here are a few pictures I uploaded to webshots.

http://rides.webshots.com/album/577860211TZRpag

 

[ruwfo]

outboardguy,

Ok, i don't know what your comparing the clutch pull too, if it's
a modern bike, then it's stiffer, nothing like a Harley

I found, if the cable lubed well, & routed correctly the pull not
too bad. Run the cable the front frame tube, I believe there's
a cable loop on the frame, tyrap it loosely about 1/2 down the
frame, then run it thru the left side motor mount hole. I made
a cable protector,by splitting a car fuel line peice then safety
wiring to the cable near were the cable arcs near the pipe.
Make sure there's a nice gradule curve to the cable were it
hooks into the case too.

Ok, carb, did you clean the float needle & check it's set.
Float should sit lever with outside (horiz) of carb housing.
Also make sure the carb slide is closing all the way, 500's
has it's own special throttle cable & someone may have replaced
it with one off another husky (non 500).

Check are head/cylinder bolts tight? always turn & leave
the petcock off, when it's not running too.

Good luck with the beast .

Husky John

 

[oldhuskychuck]

first...welcome to the Cafe...
second...forget, Harleys, outboard motors, pumping a carb ect,,,thats not the case here.
Huskys dont have any pumps that would squirt fuel, likely you need to take the carb apart, and clean it, might need a new needle and seat, or just sticky gunk in the float bowl, if the tank is nasty, likely the carb is as well.
Husky clutches can be tough, they are a mans bike, and it takes some stones to ride em,
you can ease some of the hard clutch pull, but it would take some adjustments by an experianced Husky wrench, and or clutch spring replacements, most big bore huskys came with heavy dual springs, and will have a yellow stripe painted on the side of the spring, if you get a set of spings with a white strip of paint, they are much easier, but may slip.
if youv been flooding the carb, you need to change the crank case oil, use Castol GTX 4T 20-50, since the pet cock is likely dried out, i would not leave the fuel line attached when the bike sits,,even over nite, it can fill the crank area, and will damage the piston ect, when you try and kick it over,
use good fuel, and good 2 stroke oil made for motorcycles,,,NOT OUTBOARD motors or chainsaws, spend 20.00 on a bottle of belray 2 stroke oil, not the type for oil ejection.
and follow the directions on the bottle.
removing the side cover isnt really needed at this point, get the bike running smooth and clean first, then worry about the clutch.
sometimes after the bike warms up, the clutch may get easier...

 

[fran...k.]

In no particular order,

I don't believe I have ever found much weight difference in the floats which may have a weight molded into them. I have had pinto (ford) float get totally soaked and vintage soldered brass floats spring leaks. The needle and seat is something you ought to get new and there should be an in line filter which generally motorcycles seems to come without.

I would suggest pulling out the thing the cable attaches to over near the drive sprocket on the engine. I never really dealt much with an 84, the 83 is like half flat other half round and some of the water cooled ones later have more complex angles and the other half round. On the 83 I did find the face in need of some hard facing and grinding. The hole that fits in can get worn and more modern stuff which isn't directly hydraulic clutch that seems to ride in bearings. Once you have that is shape then you adjust the thing in the center of the clutch on the actuating rod and lastly at the lever. Motion pro terminator is my preferred cable choice if it still exists and gentle bends. I know when I rode enduros on mine I paid careful attention to make as many shifts without the clutch as possible to save energy. The manuals came with exercise instructions and building up strength for the clutch is there if you look. People have lengthened the lever on the top of the engine maybe three fourths of an inch which might have been done by the factory at some point.

I would not re use or make your own base gasket I had a major problem doing one of those things however never had any issues using new gaskets from the official supplier chain.

 

[outboardguy]

First let me say Thank you for your responses!

Ruwfo,
I've never had a motorcycle, So I'm not comparing the feel to anything. The cable is new "Terry Cable". I work on Boats for a living and can appreciate the need for as little hard bends as possible. I believe I have it routed right. The clutch lever is just very hard to pull, and the old cable was broke, which leads me to believe there is something wrong. I feel if I rode this bike for a full week I would have forearms like Popeye before long.
On the Carb.I did remove the bowl and cleaned the carb before. I set the float level to 3/4"(19mm) and I blew into the inlet as I turned over the carb and it stopped my breath.I've checked my needle and seat on outboards several times with this method and never seen an issue . I figured it might be alright, but it is still leaking from the gravity feed of the tank. I guess I'll have to check it one more time. I got the the specs here http://www.motorcyclecarbs.com/manuals/mikuni/carb/vmmanual.pdf

I will verify the head bolt torque as stated. I have a feeling that a tweaker worked on this bike as I have found some very strange mistakes made on it.

HuskyChuck
I only used my outboard tank to give it fuel for my test run. I figured the needle and seat would stop my priming just like every other carb, but apparently mine is broke still.
Thanks for the heads up on the clutch springs. If and when I get in there I will check for color refererence. As far as running it for a while to help the clutch I can see that but I need to fix my other leak first, so we'll see what happens.

I'm not sure what you mean by changing the crankcase oil. The crankcase doesn't have oil in it except for the oil that is introduced with the fuel charge. Now if the gas is getting into my gear oil side then I have a different problem altogether.

I agree on the 2 stroke oil. I know there are differences between oils formulated for water cooled and air cooled motors.

Fran...k

That is what I was trying to get at. I know the old brass floats develop leaks and take on gas thus sinking them. I was just curious if anyone had seen these floats (whatever they are made of) take on fuel and get heavier. I may just buy a new needle and seat and floats to cure the problem.
Does that clutch lever just come out after removing the screw without anything popping out of place? ie. the clutch actuating rod. I'll get a better look in the next few days. I've got the next 3 days off and I'm hoping the wife won't have me in the melon patch the whole time.

Understood about the gasket


Thanks again

 

[oldhuskychuck]

you will see a big bolt on the right side of the trans,,,remove it,, watch what comes out... if nothing???you have issues...

 

[fran...k.]

First let me say Thank you for your responses!
Fran...k

That is what I was trying to get at. I know the old brass floats develop leaks and take on gas thus sinking them. I was just curious if anyone had seen these floats (whatever they are made of) take on fuel and get heavier. I may just buy a new needle and seat and floats to cure the problem.
Does that clutch lever just come out after removing the screw without anything popping out of place? ie. the clutch actuating rod. I'll get a better look in the next few days. I've got the next 3 days off and I'm hoping the wife won't have me in the melon patch the whole time.

Understood about the gasket


Thanks again

You can really find some bone head mechanic evidence on these things and I think dirt bikes in general.

I think it has six grams molded into the float not sure from memory but I have had at a minimum six of them and a scale and perhaps a tenth of a gram difference. The needle and seat will cause frustration even though the blow test gets passed with flying colors. You will never have much pleasure tuning it if the slide is sloppy in the bore of the carb, poor air cleaner maintained accelerates this however it is a heavy slide and the bike vibrates.

As for the clutch the lever on top will pull out with the seal once you remove a small bolt. I wouldn't worry about popping out of place of pieces. The seal doesn't work too well once the magnesium bore the shaft gets worn. Though I have not found any double springs in any of my 500 bikes the springs are stiffer than say a 250 and this of course accelerates wear there. You have to undo the five bolts holding the inner clutch to inspect the rod but it can be adjusted without doing that. Looking at the wear on the outer and inner clutch basket can give you an idea of how much wear is there and some believe that effects clutch pull. Terry cable is pretty much like original and what the dealer network carries. Not sure what the logic is they seem to have some stuff Moose or MSR which is still available from the supplier. Doesn't the terry cable have a provision to squirt lube in?

Fran

 

[oldhuskychuck]

the floats in your carb will be plastic, and run on chrome rods.
or, they could have used an older Mik, and it will have a standard hinge.
todays fuel is hard on the gas valve {needle and seat} when you inspect it, look for a small ring, if its just a shinney spot your ok, WD 40, and a rag will cure that, if its a step, or a groove, you will need to replace the needle.
ethenol, is hard on rubber, plastic, and fiberglass. i try and not let pump gas set in my bikes anymore, if the bike is going to sit more then a week or 2, ill drain the float bowl at least, more then a couple months, ill drain the tank as well.
and never let pump gas sit in a fiberglass tank more then a couple hours..it will destroy it fast...

 

[firecrackerkid]

All good advice Cafe members. I have only one thing to add. LOCK UP THE SIDE PANELS IN A SECURE PLACE!

 

[outboardguy]

All good advice Cafe members. I have only one thing to add. LOCK UP THE SIDE PANELS IN A SECURE PLACE!

Huh? What?

Anyway guys I removed the kicker/shift side cover. As I was doing my inspecting I found that a couple of the steels between the clutches were very hard to slide off of the splines. It appeared as if they had been damaged slightly. I cleaned them up with a sander in the right places and they started sliding on freely.

My thought is that I had the clutch way overadjusted trying to get the bike to roll freely in gear, but the clutch steels were not loose enough to release. Now that everything is free the cable did not have to be adjusted out so far to make the clutch release. All feels better now, although I found the shifter return spring just hanging inside the case loosely. I have done a little more research and found a picture with it installed correctly. So I will have to remove the cover one more time. good thing I havn't refilled it with lube yet .

Thanks for the help

 

[racemx904]

we use to add about an inch to the clutch arm on the motor and also an easy pull clutch perch and lever...

we never did get ours where the clutch was drag free....to be honest tho....I ran mine for 2 yrs and never took the cover off....

Have fun cause you now have a REAL MANS bike

 

[fran...k.]

Another thing you could do is put the plates on a flat surface and see if they are warped. I haven't studied the parts sheets and even if I did have no way of knowing what was superseded with something else. Sometimes you find aluminum and friction plates, sometimes you find steel and friction plates, sometimes there are one more of each and they are all a little thinner. It seems to me the aluminum piece at the end of the stack with the springs in it would wear just like an aluminum clutch plate and sure enough some of the used ones seem not as thick as others.

Fran.

 

[outboardguy]

Another thing you could do is put the plates on a flat surface and see if they are warped. I haven't studied the parts sheets and even if I did have no way of knowing what was superseded with something else. Sometimes you find aluminum and friction plates, sometimes you find steel and friction plates, sometimes there are one more of each and they are all a little thinner. It seems to me the aluminum piece at the end of the stack with the springs in it would wear just like an aluminum clutch plate and sure enough some of the used ones seem not as thick as others.

Fran.

Yeah I think that was the problem. one or two of my aluminum plates were bent slightly. I finessed them a bit and now they release. At least I'll feel better knowing I can stop putting the power to the wheels on my shakedown of the bike.

I did notice that Husqvarna-parts carries a set of steels that are actually steel. They state that the aluminum ones will contaminate your gear oil very quickly, and the steels will not quite so bad. I'm going to keep it in mind. I'm trying to keep this bike on the lowest budget possible.I bought it for $100 and have put around $300 into it so far. The wife has already been giving it the evil eye because I have too many projects.
Thanks again for the advice

 

[SA63]

Hey outboard guy,
this may be too obvious to write but as you are new to bikes.. you dont need to drain the oil to work on the clutch or shift. mech, lay the bike on its side.

have you worked out the shifter spring? It goes over the gear selector linkage screw point (claw shaped thing) and the spring arms twist over so the gear lever can always return to original position, can only really work one way, so im sure youll work it out..

You have chosen one hell of a machine to start your motorcycle career on!

There are volumes written on the best starting techniques, but in short they like lots of fuel so I like soft priming kicks , 6- 10 soft ones with choke,(no throttle), then you have to kick it like you mean it and again- really obvious one but if you are new, stand on a crate next to the bike for more leverage, save that back! 500s arent the easiest things to light up. If you flood it, fuel off, throttle fully open and itll blubber into life.

Im more of a maico guy which come with decompressors but thats another story..

The cheaters way to start is to have a can of aerostart (which most bigbore owners have sneaked away somewhere!)
Check how worn your slide is, as its a good indication of how worn out the carb (and the motor) is, if its had a rough life ,been dusted etc.
Worn out carbs have led to many a frustated bike owner and erratic starting..Im sure other people here can give you the standard jetting figures to check as well.

Im sure youll work it out as no doubt youve played with many a cantankarous outboard!
Good luck - keep the wife happy - we all know about that one!

 

[outboardguy]

Hey outboard guy,
this may be too obvious to write but as you are new to bikes.. you dont need to drain the oil to work on the clutch or shift. mech, lay the bike on its side.

have you worked out the shifter spring? It goes over the gear selector linkage screw point (claw shaped thing) and the spring arms twist over so the gear lever can always return to original position, can only really work one way, so im sure youll work it out..

You have chosen one hell of a machine to start your motorcycle career on!

There are volumes written on the best starting techniques, but in short they like lots of fuel so I like soft priming kicks , 6- 10 soft ones with choke,(no throttle), then you have to kick it like you mean it and again- really obvious one but if you are new, stand on a crate next to the bike for more leverage, save that back! 500s arent the easiest things to light up. If you flood it, fuel off, throttle fully open and itll blubber into life.

Im more of a maico guy which come with decompressors but thats another story..

The cheaters way to start is to have a can of aerostart (which most bigbore owners have sneaked away somewhere!)
Check how worn your slide is, as its a good indication of how worn out the carb (and the motor) is, if its had a rough life ,been dusted etc.
Worn out carbs have led to many a frustated bike owner and erratic starting..Im sure other people here can give you the standard jetting figures to check as well.

Im sure youll work it out as no doubt youve played with many a cantankarous outboard!
Good luck - keep the wife happy - we all know about that one!

Nope I didn't realize that you could just lay it on the right side. I just removed the gear oil. Oh well, by the time I'm done it will be well flushed.

That damn shifter spring has still got me confused. I saw a picture of it on cyclepedia but it appeared as if the arms of the spring crossed each other before hitting the shifter #'s 28 and 31 on page 68 of the fischehttp://docs.husqvarnaoutlet.com/parts//1984%20ALL%20Parts.pdf
If I cross the spring the shifter won't move and if I force the shifter harder it will make a popping noise and when I remove the cover the spring is loose again. Does anyone have pictures of how it's supposed to go?

I have yet to get back into the carb to stop the flooding problem, but I am confident that is my starting problem.

Thanks Again for the input
Adam

 

[SA63]

I can send send you a photo of my 510 4stroke ( same though)with the clutch cover off. I cant post up pictures but can email you a pic. pm me and ill email you the photo

 

[outboardguy]

I can send send you a photo of my 510 4stroke ( same though)with the clutch cover off. I cant post up pictures but can email you a pic. pm me and ill email you the photo

Thanks. I actually found a pretty good picture when I was looking through the older posts.
http://www.cafehusky.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5357&page=3

I see it crossing over itself but I can never seem to get mine to work. Maybe the spring is too bent on mine. I might try to see if I can get a replacement.

Thanks Again

 

[halffast]

While you are figuring out the spring situation you might want to try grinding the kicker pawl plate as mentioned in one of the earlier threads you have probably read on starting these beasts . I did it to my '84 500CR and the kicker now engages at about the 1 o'clock position instead of at 3 o'clock before . I have to stand on something to kick it anyway and this provides more engine turn over than the one "pop" the kicker used to give .