Carbs vs EFI......which to buy?

[slopaso]

I am going to be a new Husky owner. I am currently shopping for a 2006-2009 model years TE450. At least that is what I am finding in my price range. My dilemma is that I am nowhere near a Husky dealership and I am not a mechanic at all. So I am trying to find out if I should get an earlier carbureted bike or the later EFI bike.

Can anyone offer advice as to which is more reliable and/or easier for a non-Husky private mechanic to service?

I live at sea level and don't really get too far from the coastal mountain range for riding. Chances of going to higher elevations like the Sierras or Rockies are slim to none, so carb settings not really a concern.

 

[RHOK]

I sold my carby wr450f to buy an injected husky

to hell with messing around with jets and the carby getting blocked and the choke etc

fuel injection - starts every time first time no choke needed etc - let the computer do the work

 

[Coffee]

Might depend on what shows up on the market...

Personally I prefer carb, but obviously efi works too. efi was introduced in 2008 and has been steadily improved every year.

This place is about 160 miles from you, less than 3 hours. That is indeed not close but compared to the folks in other states it would seem right next door - and Paul certainly knows how to ride.
http://www.tri-countypowersports.com

 

[krieg]

EFI all the way! Soon you'll be able to tune your bike with your cell phone. Wirelessly. Think I'm crazy? Write this down and come back to this post in 5-10 years so I can say "told ya so"... I'm stoked about injected 2-strokes as well. But for now I must still carry dinosaur tools and jets with me on my 2 stroke adventures (instead of a 10" laptop).

 

[MotoMarc36]

EFI is awesome. I'm totally sold on it and work on it all the time as a professional mechanic. But in the context of your question, a carbed TE450 has less bugs to work out. If you find an EFI TE450 that has been "fixed" it will work well but will depend on what you find and the honesty/integrity of the seller. The Keihin-carbed TE450's (05-07) work very well and will be easier for a private mechanic to service, especially one unfamiliar with EFI.

 

[oregonsage]

I agree with everyone who says EFI is the preferred choice......today
However, given the specific model you are shopping I might very well choose the carb. EFI has made significant strides in the last 3-4 years and if we were talking about a 2011 or newer bike my recommendation would be EFI all the way.

 

[Coffee]

As soon as I can tune my EFI at home with my laptop without having to buy software then I am in...

Don't you already have a efi bike? The 2011 sm630?

I do not think you will see any Husqvarna efi bike that you could connect to a computer without special software & hardware, any time soon.

 

[Coffee]

...It would be nice if eventually all EFI systems came with a std USB port and low cost (or free) software so you could tweak and share ignition and EFI maps.

That would indeed be nice, but my impression is they are heading in the exact opposite direction... but I really don't know.

 

[BrandonR]

It would be nice if there was a standard interface like the OBDII interface that's mandated in cars but with motorcycles being such a small market it'll probably never get regulated. I can buy a $24 OBDII module with bluetooth and read/reset codes from my phone on any car built in the last 10 years, standards are good. Look at how few actual standards there are with motorcycles, they try to make everything possible proprietary.

 

[Tinken]

Coffee,
Not meaning to slam EFI, I was speaking in general terms. I have 2 EFI bikes. I just hate it when they build closed systems on anything. My EFI runs great now, but without the JD I would be in trouble. My FCR carbed bikes ran great out of the box. It would be nice if eventually all EFI systems came with a std USB port and low cost (or free) software so you could tweak and share ignition and EFI maps. That is the direction my industrial equipment is going. Now I wish JD made an ignition programmer so I could play with the ig curve. So far the only option I am aware of is using the TE ECU. Cam.

http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/updated-tps-efi-reset-449-511.28799/#post-258671

 

[Phoenix]

I have mixed feelings on the matter. We have one carbed Husky (2009 TXC 450) and one EFI Husky (2010 TXC 250). Here's my personal pro/con list:

Like about EFI

Tune it with a computer. Changing settings doesn't require removing a carb or unbolting anything.
Low fuel light on dash.
No petcock to turn off.
Bike doesn't pour gas from the carb when laid over

Dislike about EFI

You need a lot of patience and the software to get the tuning right.
The fuel system is very sensitive. You have to be more careful about contaminants in your gas. A tiny little particle can clog your nozzle.
There are a few more variables that can be the cause of problems: low battery, temp sensor, relays, fuel pump, more fuses, etc. etc.
All Mikuni-based Husky EFI requires a charged battery to run. Dead battery? You're pushing.

I think that EFI is very cool and is the way of the future. However, I think that Mikuni EFI sucks and is quirky. Like a carb, though, if the fueling is not right, JD sells a tuner that bolts right on and works some magic to mask any stock problems.

 

[john01]

Get a SmartCarb for the carb bikes; problems solved (4 stroke versions to follow the 2 stroke that are out now). I got one for my WB165 and today cleaning up my work area I put the box of Mikuni jets, needles, etc away. No more jetting ! And no FI problems I keep reading about.

 

[krieg]

My Keihin EFI bikes have pretty much been flawless.

 

[MotoMarc36]

I'm sure a smartcarcb works well and is a step up from the stock carbs, but it is NOT efi-accurate. To understand how poorly ANY carburetor (all rely on vaccum to meter fuel) meters fuel, you have to see it real-time on a Dyno with an Air/fuel sensor hooked up. It is amazing how unable they are to deliver a consistent air/fuel ratio and they are all over the place at different throttle positions and RPM's. EFI has the ability to deliver any target AFR and stay within a half point of that AFR over all throttle positions and RPM's. Carbs, ANY carbs, simply do not and it is horifying to watch and amazing things run as well as they do with them. I've read all the good word on the smartcarb and it may be great for some, but for the price no thanks I'll spend it on fresh tires for a year.

 

[firebolter]

EFI versus Carb'd bikes is much like oil-----Everybody has their perspective. There is no absolute/right answer. It depends on what motivates you.

I have both and from a pure "simplicity" perspective, I want a carb'd bike for the woods. My EFI Husky runs great, I have had no issues other than the pump coming out of it's nest (easy fix), but as pointed out, there are additional electrical circuits in play and Fuel Pumps etc. that can fail.

EFI IS NOT AUTOMATICALLY BETTER, it is only as good as the mapping that goes with it. Yes you can adjust it but it take software and a Dyno/sniffer to do it absolutely right. Once you get a EFI bike set up, then YES, you are good to go until something fails, which can also happen on a Carb'd bike. The best thing I did on mine was to get the Husky Race ECU, that is great mapping and the bike runs great with no need to adjust the CO settings over default of 100/100/100

 

[Weantright]

Coffee,
Not meaning to slam EFI, I was speaking in general terms. I have 2 EFI bikes. I just hate it when they build closed systems on anything. My EFI runs great now, but without the JD I would be in trouble. My FCR carbed bikes ran great out of the box. It would be nice if eventually all EFI systems came with a std USB port and low cost (or free) software so you could tweak and share ignition and EFI maps. That is the direction my industrial equipment is going. Now I wish JD made an ignition programmer so I could play with the ig curve. So far the only option I am aware of is using the TE ECU. Cam.

EPA is killing these bikes! EPA doesn't want you to adjust anything. Some of the newer bikes have locked ECU's to prevent us from de-smogging them. Where there a will, there's a way like off-road ECU's, dealers re-map, tunners,,, Carbs will be gone shortly for all on-road motors and will be unadjustable to the average rider. Your FCR bike ran good out of the box, what year is it?? off road?? This plays a role in "out of box" performance. If you had a new modern EFI bike without any EPA crap and tuned for performance not caring if it's green stickered, you would never want a carb bike again even with the simplistic design. That's not the world we live in!

Firebolter - EFI is automatically better, then it goes to the EPA!

 

[firebolter]

Well we'll see. Owning both, raced both and for now, I'll take a carb'd bike for my main off road weapon of choice. Again, not knocking EFI, just not overly in love with it either. Like it on my Street bike (K1300S). There are new carb technologies coming more to the forefront that give you the same basic benefits as EFI without the added complexity. I just bought a APT carb for the new Berg smoker and we'll see how that goes. To date, it is working very well for those that are running them. No jets to deal with. It compensates for altitude and temp variances like EFI but without needinf a fuel pump and additional electrical circuits there by keeping it simpler. Each to his own!

Like I said, fuel injection is only as good as the mapping that goes with it. Guys like JD will always have business as long as the EPA is around.

 

[Vinduro]

I like carbs.........With that said I have been making the move back to Lectron carbs. EFI like performance without the complexity. I had Quicksilvers on my Honda 4 stroke and they were designed by the same guy. Edelbrock discontinued the Quiksilver. Lectrons are also altitude compensating. Better metering of fuel. Better economy. Better throttle response. Especially on a 2 stroke. They also have them for 4 strokes but I don't think they have an accelerator pump. I had Quicksilvers with AC pump and without. I actually liked the non pump model better. Better fuel economy and less jumpy in tight woods. The AC pump throttle response was actually too quick. I like a bit more control.

 

[flyingbob]

Well we'll see. Owning both, raced both and for now, I'll take a carb'd bike for my main off road weapon of choice. Again, not knocking EFI, just not overly in love with it either. Like it on my Street bike (K1300S). There are new carb technologies coming more to the forefront that give you the same basic benefits as EFI without the added complexity. I just bought a APT carb for the new Berg smoker and we'll see how that goes. To date, it is working very well for those that are running them. No jets to deal with. It compensates for altitude and temp variances like EFI, but without needing a fuel pump and additional electrical circuits thereby keeping it simpler. Each to his own!
Like I said, fuel injection is only as good as the mapping that goes with it. Guys like JD will always have business as long as the EPA is around.

I have 20+ hours on my APT carb. I've bought another one and intend to put one on every bike I have (except the TM) I'm also going to buy a Lectron and will provide another third party back to back opinion. I've only owned one FI dirtbike and that was enough for me. I pulled my bike out of the trailer on Christmas Day to show the carb to my visiting son. 33°F, one kick and idling smoothly!