All 2st Increasing oil = increased compression?

[pvduke]

oh yeh.... i know a spot or two like that down here...but...ahem.

nice pic kel!

 

[Dirtdame]

We have a few tight trails down this way (with rocks, too).

 

[ghte]

Just a small point 2 strokes do not like high compression (they pre detonate). Don't know if upping the oil would be sufficient for that to occur however. As an aside I put synthetic 2 stroke oil (spectra) in my 4 strokes as well at 100:1. Absolutley convinved over many years that is why my valves never move, my comp stays high. I have not noticed any smoking and I am positive it keeps the fuel fresh.

 

[BillO]

JASO is just a minimum rating not nessessarily the best for racing. Different base stocks are used. Some heavier, Some lighter. Some Petroleum based , Some Synthetic, Some Vegetable. No, Oils are not the same. Infact there are several different type synthetic base stocks. Ester, Pao, and Group III (which is not a true synthetic). Different levels of refinement in Petroleum basestocks. Different additive packages. Some oils have higher flash points that others. Some will clog a spark arrestor in short order and other will burn clean. The oil that may suffice for a light usage street or play bike might not hold up under the stress of racing. You can use any oil you want but I will use one that is designed for the stresses of Racing.

Okay, I see where you're coming from. I guess from that perspective I can partially agree. However, on a couple of points we diverge or are thinking differently.

First, on the JASO thing, I disagree. JASO FD is a pretty high classification. Very few oils claim they meet or exceed this classification. In fact, on the 2T oil side of things, most companies do not quote compliance with classification standards. This is really a shame as the consumer really does not know what they are getting if the oil company does not adhere to standards. Most of us can not claim enough knowledge in this matter to know for sure, and apparently, neither do the oil companies.

Second, I've ony met Hammer a few times, but he does not strike me as any kind of fool. I am sure his claim, that there is not much difference between oils, was not intended to cross from 100% ester synthetics to castor bean oil. Correct me if I'm wrong Armin, but I'd bet you were comparing apples to apples (eg. Bel-Ray H1R to Red-line Racing).

Finally, despite that fact that there are huge differences in the make-up of Bel-ray H1R and Maxima 927, for example, there is not much difference at the end of the day. They are both viable and trusted solutions to the same problem - lubrication of high performance 2-stoke engines.

In the end, it’s all good. Pick a top of the line oil from your favourite oil company and go ride.

 

[lankydoug]

Here is something to think about; What is your oil doing for you when you're not riding? Race synthetics used at 100:1 may be fine in a race engine that is well maintained and taken apart often and inspected but for the guy who's bike may sit for a month or two between rides that mix may not be protecting his crankcase parts from surface rust caused by condensation and fuel impurities like alcohol that absorb moisture. This rust (iron oxide) once formed in your crankcase is like sandpaper. I believe the synthetics are much better at reducing friction but the weekend warrior like me may want to look for a synthetic blend and mix it closer to 40:1 so when your not riding there is a coating left in your crankcase protecting it from oxidation.

 

[gsxr1000user]

Lankydoug,

I read exactly that point several years ago in an airplane mag. Piston planes that is. Seemed that some engine failures had been traced to Mobil 1 not due to lack of lubrication, but lack of any residue or burnt on coating of the internals.

 

[lankydoug]

Lankydoug,

I read exactly that point several years ago in an airplane mag. Piston planes that is. Seemed that some engine failures had been traced to Mobil 1 not due to lack of lubrication, but lack of any residue or burnt on coating of the internals.

There are some fuel additives and octane boosters that act like a super solvent in your crankcase that leave parts so clean that with very little moisture rust begins to form. I have had personal experience running nitromethane with methanol on 4 stroke engines. If you didn't change the oil in the crankcase when you got home in the evening by the next day the internals would look like you left them out in the rain for a month.

 

[hammer]

Okay, I see where you're coming from. I guess from that perspective I can partially agree. However, on a couple of points we diverge or are thinking differently.

First, on the JASO thing, I disagree. JASO FD is a pretty high classification. Very few oils claim they meet or exceed this classification. In fact, on the 2T oil side of things, most companies do not quote compliance with classification standards. This is really a shame as the consumer really does not know what they are getting if the oil company does not adhere to standards. Most of us can not claim enough knowledge in this matter to know for sure, and apparently, neither do the oil companies.

Second, I've ony met Hammer a few times, but he does not strike me as any kind of fool. I am sure his claim, that there is not much difference between oils, was not intended to cross from 100% ester synthetics to castor bean oil. Correct me if I'm wrong Armin, but I'd bet you were comparing apples to apples (eg. Bel-Ray H1R to Red-line Racing).

Finally, despite that fact that there are huge differences in the make-up of Bel-ray H1R and Maxima 927, for example, there is not much difference at the end of the day. They are both viable and trusted solutions to the same problem - lubrication of high performance 2-stoke engines.

In the end, it’s all good. Pick a top of the line oil from your favourite oil company and go ride.

Yes Bill apples to apples. I'm glad I didn't come off as some kind of fool, some would think otherwise