Radiator leak

[bandkw]

I bought a new 2009 TXC 450 last August. I added Flatland radiator braces before my first ride. Two races and a few trail miles later, I put her away for the winter.

Got her back out this spring. Did normal spring service, added a vector computer and switched out the stock coolent for engine ice when I installed the temperature sensor. I did a 2 hour race and 30 mile trial ride - no problems.

On the next trail ride, the radiator started leaking. My guess was that the radiator cap blew as I have read about this in the forums. I finished the ride going as fast as possible and using the clutch as little as possible to keep her cool (only 55 degrees outside) and took her home. I purchased a new CV4 30 psi cap to solve the problem. It arrived the next Friday. The radiator is still leaking.

I removed the radiators, got them into a local shop on Tuesday, and picked them up again yesterday. The guy who fixed them is the only local guy who will work on aluminum radiators, and was recommended to me by many of my friends who had their radiators fixed by him. He
had me look inside and pointed out a black coloring on the core and the weld repairs he needed to do. Apparently, the radiators are eating themselves due to electrolosis. A ring of aluminum had corroded away all around the inlet port on the right side (cap side) radiator, and this was where the lead was coming from. Absolutely no crash damage, and on the back side of the radiator. Pretty cool!! A bike with less than 300 miles on it has already eaten its own radiator... :rant:

I have talked to a couple people including my dealer and gotten thier feedback on why this is happening. Anyone out there have an opinion to share before I write what they are thinking I need to do to solve the problem?????

I have been reading the forums looking for any other mentions of a problem like this. It doesn't look common.

Thanks, Keith

 

[grumnut01]

yep,happended to me as well.

LHS radiator cracked whilst on a remote trail. Hairline crack, 5 o'clock to 8 o'clock position underneath inlet nozzle, on radiator top box. TE 450 '09.

I suspected the cracking was caused by a bending moment placed on the nozzle when I installed the uptite Y and reinstalled the hoses. I think the hoses were pulling down on the nozzle, coupled with the vibrations from the engine - caused a crack in the rad - IMHO.

Lesson #1 - make sure hoses do not pull down on the radiator nozzles when installing the Y-piece.

Lesson #2 - JB weld kit got me out of the situation to enable riding for the rest of the day . Always carry one of these in your toolkit.

cheers ag

 

[Coffee]

Hi Kieth!

My hunch is you also posted on TT about the same issue. I can assure you I've never read a post about electrolysis eating a Husqvarna radiator. And as I stated on tt, I doubt that is happening. I would put an ammeter on one of the battery leads to measure current if you wanted to follow up on that theory.

Measure current, unbolt radiator / remove hoses / etc and see if the current changes. For electrolysis to cause damage in that short amount of time there needs to be some reasonable current involved, possibly 1 or more milliamps. Obviously there will probably be current going other places such as the Vector computer which you need to ignore.

What is common is for people to put on radiator braces which affect cooling, and some of them require removal of the vents (louvers) which help cool the bike. At least 1 person went through 12 radiators until he modified his radiator braces for more flow.

I would not want to be around when something went wrong with a 30psi radiator cap on the radiator.

Be sure to change the crossover tube between the radiators to re-enforced hose, stock it is not re-enforced.

 

[bandkw]

Yep Coffee, same person. I put it on both boards hoping to get some more feedback. In searching the threads, I've found a lot of posts about radiators cracking where there is no damage and in relatively well supported areas. Made me wonder if this is related. Right now I have no proof, just a theory that I haven't had time to test yet.

The best off-forum advice I've gotten so far is from my dealer who also sells boats and has solved real electrolosis problems many times when different metals are put together. He hadn't heard about a problem like this on bikes either, but figures if this is electrolosis, than the problem is that the rubber dampers between the bike frame and radiators are doing too good of a job and keeping a built up electrical charge from getting out of the radiators, in other words they are not grounded. He and the guy who repaired the radiators both suggested I put them back on the bike exactly as I had taken them off and then test the radiator fluid for a charge. If I find anything, my dealer suggested running ground lines from the radiator back to the engine to properly ground them and then test for a charge again, hopefully finding either no charge or a much lower reading. I will hopefully get to do some testing this weekend to see what I can find. If no charge, I'll look at the braces and explore the no air flow theory. The only thing that makes me think the braces shouldn't be the problem is I have done two hour races in 85 degree temperatures with no apparent issue. The break occured on a day that was only 55 degrees, and on wide and fast single track. Heck, there was snow on the ground that morning, so cooling should not have been an issue. Then again, the damage may have been done on those warm days, and the broken radiator "symptom" may have shown up on this day because they warmed up too quickly.

Anyone else out there have radiator trouble until they either removed or modified their Flatland Racing radiator guards?

Except for the cooling system, my TXC has been a great bike. I had people tell me they had seen the crossover tube issue in stories, but didn't know of any that had blown up in real life. Mine blew up in a tight section of woods last summer during my "let's get aquainted" / break-in weekend with her. I did a variable speed fire road ride, then an oil change, then went out on a longer and funner ride with some single track and a short tight section from last year's enduro. A hot radiator fluid steam bath on your wrist feels pretty refreshing. The TXC has had the reinforced crossover hose ever since.

Looking at some other threads, I wanted to get a 26 psi cap, but only found the 20psi and 30psi caps in the catalogs at my local dealer. With those two choices, I figured I'd go high instead of having another lower pressure cap blow. Hopefully I can solve this problem soon and just NOT have anymore radiator issues with non-damaged cores.

 

[RLW]

I'm having trouble buying the electrolysis theory. I have heard of that being blamed for eating a modified street car aluminum radiator over a much longer time frame, but never heard of, or know anyone, that had it happen on their bikes.

I think I would first suspect a bad radiator might have slipped thru QA at the manufacturer, and a little vibration may have cracked a joint causing it to leak??? (just a guess)

I personally know the stock radiator caps can go bad, (& replaced mine w/a CV4 1.4bar - 20psi ) but when it lets loose, you know it.......I got a nice little steam cloud and hot coolant shot down the overflow hose, and blew out the catch tank right onto my leg......a real attention getter.
I had to top off with water to finish loop and later eruptions were just out the overflow...again cooking my leg.
FYI: The higher psi cap increases internal system pressure to raise boiling point of fluid and reduces chance of blow off. It does not make the bike run cooler or cure a leaking radiator. In fact it may make a leak worse due to the higher system pressure

 

[glangston]

These bikes get hot fast when new. My broken in 08 TE 250 only starts to feel warm after 3 min or so of idle. I was at the shop today and George fired up a new 2010 TXC 250 and it was warm in a minute or so, definitely putting out a lot more heat more quickly than a broken in bike.

 

[bandkw]

My post-test report:

I reassembled everything by connecting hoses to the radiators without tightening any clamps, then I attempted to mount the radiators and braces to the frame. In doing so, I found that the replacement crossover tube I had installed was too long and put a lot of pressure on the radiator fittings. I cut the tube shorter so everything assembled easily and then tightened all the hose clamps after everything was in its place and happy. When I saw how much pressure was on the radiator fittings from the overlength hoses, I started thinking RLW was the most on target with diagnosing my problem.

Because of Coffee's suggestion about the braces, I searched the threads on Thumpertalk for braces and found a link to a test a guy had done with similar braces and an XR600. He found that the radiator braces alone raised the temperature of his radiators by about 10 degrees, but that went away when he attached his louvers back on the front of his braces. That made sense to me as it directs air to the inside part of the radiator so there will be good airflow everywhere, so I cut the inside tabs off my stock louvers and zip tied the louvers to my braces. Finally, I added engine ice and tested the fluid for current - there was none.

Saturday I did about 25 miles on easy single track, Sunday I rode 51 additional miles in an Enduro on tight single track with lots of whoops. When I got home, I tested for current again and found ... absolutely no charge.

My radiators worked great, no leaks or lost fluid in 75 miles even after three small crashes. The bike ran cooler all weekend. I'm guessing this is mostly because of the lack of air leaks in the system, but may also have a little to do with the louvers being back on the bike. I'm not sure about this, but it is working good so they are staying put.

I now believe my problem was too much pressure from the hoses and welding that could be a little better on the stock radiators, hence the reason Mylers does the reinforcement welding. Even though I don't believe our local radiator guy's idea about electrical charge in the radiators, I do believe he did a good job of repairing them and I don't expect to see any additional problems.

Thanks for the input everyone. See you in the woods...

 

[MartinP518]

The clutch lever side radiator cracked after 2 ride on my 2010 CR144. A huge crack right around where the top hose connects. I did a JB weld job on it and it's been fine. On my fifth ride, the throttle side radiator cracked somewhere in the middle, but I was at the track, 3hour drive from home. Tryed to jb weld it again, but gave it too little time to dry, and the result is that it got a little worse. I also had a broken engine mount after the third ride. This bike is self destructing and got only like 7 hours of riding on MX tracks.
I ordered new rads from china. Two of my mates got these for their KXF and are really satisfied. Check ebay http://myworld.ebay.com/ebaymotors/asi_performance/

 

[jjg76]

I ride a 2009 TE510 and I recently experienced the exact same crack as described by MartinP518. I believe this is likely a QC or design issue. I've had several bikes over the years and this is the first time I had a radiator break without any physical damage being induced via a crash. The bike is otherwise pretty tough. I had a local radiator shop solder over the crack and it fixed the issue. Poor quality cost me $40.