Random Stall – a Silver Bullett or as close as we may get. TR650 Husky

[kiwiape]

I’ve been testing two things to try and overcome the following;

1. Cold start/warm up stall at 1750-2200rpm
2. Over run to gentle throttle-on stall/miss , below 2500rpm

NB. My bike is stock standard and only has a UNI Air Filter.

First thing;
a)Spark Plugs.

I’ve tried a number of different plugs including two recommend by the Brisk agent in Australia. Neither got rid, nor reduced the problems and the good old NGK CR7E was as good as any and it stayed very clean due to it being a 7 heat range.



However, I have just installed the Pulstar JE2RT8 https://www.pulstar.com/buy-now/product/JE2RT8 (gap set to 0.6mm) and this has dramatically reduced #1 and #2 above. On top of this I feel the motor simply goes better!, more power and good response.


The Pulstar is about 12mm taller than a standard plug and requires the COP to be supported in the rocker cover, which I did with addition of two O rings (see below).


Second thing:
b)Injectors.

This is a simple bolt is situation, but requires removal of side covers and lifting of the air box which took 30 minutes to get to and the same to put it back together. The 0280158124 injector can deliver 10% more fuel and because I needed more fuel on cold warm-up when ECU is Open Loop or light throttle load it was perfect and when the ECU goes Closed Loop the excess fuel is reduced. To understand this click here http://www.lambdapower.co.uk/TechNotes/Tech-3.asp. Installing the 124 injector reduced #1 and #2 above to almost nil. Theses injectors are easily found on Ebay.


1)TR650 OE injector;
Bosh part # :0280158058
Flow rate :237 g/min
Cone(s) :Single cone 25 degree
Connector :Jetronic

2)Alternative I have used;
Bosh part # :0280158124
Flow rate : 261 g/min (10% bigger)
Cone(s) ;Dual cone 20 degree
Connector :Jetronic




Alternatives below that are OE locked (you must go to franchise that sells them);

3)This injector is used the 2015 model Jeep Renegade (OE#4627652) and the Fiat (OE#55241175) sharing the 1.4 turbo Multiair engine and are OE locked.
Bosh part # :0280158300
Flow rate ;251 g/min
Cone(s) ;Dual cone
Connector :Jetronic

4)Porsche OE # 997 605 132 91. Available only from Porsche and is OE locked.
Bosh part # :0280158271
Flow rate ;310 g/min
Cone(s) ;Dual cone 27 degree
Connector :Jetronic



At this point I have not run both Plug and Injector (#0280158124) together as I wanted to see just how much effect they had, but when I do I will post more info.

 

[DeLewis]

Hey Kiwiape, you've obviously been very thorough in finding a solution - thanks for sharing. I will definitely have a look at these products.

 

[drzcharlie]

Great work on this. Did you test the plugs and then add the injectors? Or perhaps, plugs then injectors separately?

I added this research to the linked thread index - Part B, Engine

 

[hasenpfeffer]

Excellent work!

I notice you haven't used the AR10ZS plug from Brisk. This is different from the Brisk plug you show above. I'd be curious what your experience with the AR10ZS would be if you aren't completely tired of spending too much time and money on your excellent effort.

 

[mag00]

Hey Kiwiape, do you have a pic of the Pulstar inslalled? Did you do both plugs?

I had talked with the folks at pusltar quite awhile ago, and when the said they were about a half inch longer than stock, I opted for the brisk Multispark. The Pulstar would have been my first choice. I must admit, while I like the product, their sales pitch and "super hype" is a bit off putting to me.

Adding the larger capacity injector is a great idea, and curious how it will perform long term. I had looked at a 500cc injector, but since other than not starting perfect, my Terra runs superb. Some injector "expert" somewhere online was saying bigger injector was a bad idea on the BMW based bikes, but I find that hard to believe. The extra fuel squirt at low rpm and closed loop starting from a larger flowing injector just seemed like a good idea. Then the o2 system can take over at driving conditions and dial it all back to normal fuel flow.

I have a dobeck fueler I will be adding later on, with a switchable on/off, purely for power. Might be a good idea to get the larger injector for this.

About the plugs again, are you monitoring fuel economy? Will be interesting as you changed the injector and plugs. If you break even, no net gain or loss, that would be wonderful.

Thanks for the info and updates

 

[MotocycleWriter]

 

[kiwiape]

Here's the Pulstar's installed..you can see the O rings. O rings are O.D. 32mm with 5mm & 6mm walls (per my picture above).


Heres a pic of the 124 injector exactly the same fitment as OE.

 

[nwrider1]

FWIW Bosh part # :0280158124 is available from Summit Racing for about $97.

 

[kiwiape]

I paid Euro 46.03 + freight Ebay. Auction number 381145004154

 

[Mark_H]

I am very interested in this, along with many others, and am eager to give it a try, but I am trying to avoid some issues with shipping to Philippines.
Also I was looking at information on AdvRider about replacing the fuel injector in BMW GS650 to cure similar issues but I can only find a few details that possibly an injector from a VW 1.8 T engine will fit.
Problem is that if I go to a supplier in Philippines with the Bosch part number 0280158124 and they see that it seems to only fit a Ferrari, I might as well invite them all for dinner as well, the price will go through the roof !
Has anyone any ideas or Bosch part numbers of similar injectors that will fit the TR650 ? I would prefer to go to VW dealers than Ferrari :-)

One other thing, I tried to put the Husky OEM Injector number 0280158058 into a Bosch search site and got nothing, but Google finds it available and same injector for BMW GS650 too ???

 

[kiwiape]

I am very interested in this, along with many others, and am eager to give it a try, but I am trying to avoid some issues with shipping to Philippines.
Also I was looking at information on AdvRider about replacing the fuel injector in BMW GS650 to cure similar issues but I can only find a few details that possibly an injector from a VW 1.8 T engine will fit.
Problem is that if I go to a supplier in Philippines with the Bosch part number 0280158124 and they see that it seems to only fit a Ferrari, I might as well invite them all for dinner as well, the price will go through the roof !
Has anyone any ideas or Bosch part numbers of similar injectors that will fit the TR650 ? I would prefer to go to VW dealers than Ferrari :-)

One other thing, I tried to put the Husky OEM Injector number 0280158058 into a Bosch search site and got nothing, but Google finds it available and same injector for BMW GS650 too ???

The only injectors with same fitment are in my list above. Can you use Ebay? the seller I got mine from is idir-autoteile I will contact him for if you like..? Heres the auction http://www.ebay.com/itm/38114500415...l?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=381145004154&_rdc=1

 

[Mark_H]

The only injectors with same fitment are in my list above. Can you use Ebay? the seller I got mine from is idir-autoteile I will contact him for if you like..? Heres the auction http://www.ebay.com/itm/381145004154?ru=http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=381145004154&_rdc=1

Ok thanks for the info, I found 0280158124 on Amazon UK at a good price, I will explore the shipping options.
Preferably I would like to order and buy from a Bosch supplier direct, so I will take a look when I am back home.

 

[WayneC]

Re the Pulstar plug

It adds a capacitive element to the ignition circuit as per the old CDI systems, it increases efficiency of conversion of electrical energy to plasma from around 10% to 30%. It took many years to perfect making the capacitors small enough to fit into the plugs. The early product from Pulstar was an add on capacitor which fitted over a conventional plug and I have run that for 8 years on my Dakar in a slightly more radical way than the Pulstar plugs. I have had no failures or problems, it is still doing what it is designed to do

We now have other Dakar's fitted with the Pulstar plug and all have reported the improvements roughly in line with what I have.

The injector KiwiApe tracked down sounds like a better solution than the G650X owners are using and there are a couple of late model Dakar owners putting it under test now so it will be interesting to hear what the results are

 

[rww]

WOW did the plugs make a difference ......the bike seems to run better everywhere...and much better starting off from a stop. The made the EJK much more effective.

 

[kiwiape]

WOW did the plugs make a difference ......the bike seems to run better everywhere...and much better starting off from a stop. The made the EJK much more effective.

. Try taking the EJK out......? in the interest of gathering data.

 

[WayneC]

A dual spark Dakar owner who had gone the whole hog with PC, Autotune and customised maps plus an Accelerator module was sceptical re the Pulstar but he fitted both the Pulstar and the EV14 injector

The result was this post

"It is now like sh!t off a stick. Front comes up in first and second gear off the throttle."

I think I will take it that he is no longer sceptical and that a simple plug replacement did more than all the other $ he spent

 

[rww]

I think I'm going to put a fuel injector in and pull the EJK. I would like to have the ECM's ability to compensate for elevation changes working. I will start with taking out the EJK when I get back from the BMW rally in billings and see how it works.

 

[WayneC]

From the GS911 testing and other aspects I seem to have been roped into I put together a pdf with all the info we learned re the ECU's and other electronics/electrical on the the Terra, it is available from the diagnostics page I have on line, see the Husky Terra Information pdf

It has listings of the various firmware revisions which are out there for the ECU's other than ABS as the machines I have looked at have not had ABS

http://www.f650gs.crossroadz.com.au/Diagnostics.html

 

[vodka]

Bugger ....more money.... oh well thats why I go to work......

 

[AUS_TR650]

My only apprehension for not proceeding at this stage is the width & direction of spray of the dual cone injector vs. the stock item. Not having inspected the port size & shape of the '650, my concerns could be unfounded. Just don't want the spray to lose its atomisation, forming droplets and washing down the cylinder wall.
I'm going to do some more research as it is a simple plug & play mod with no additional modules or interface required. The shop that rebuilds our injectors & turbos is a Bosch agent so maybe they have a catalogue which details injector design.