TE630 dyno results and thoughts

[Fast1]

Update from my perspective.

I installed my Leo Vince full system on my SM630. Since I do not need a spark arrestor for street use I pulled it. Wow.. what a difference in air flow now that a minor restriction was removed. I've got my Ibeat settings at 110,110,120 and the bike is lean with deceleration popping. I'm going to bump it up to 111,111,122 and try it. This is with a un-altered stock intake.

XR750,, If you get deceleration popping at the 108,108,116 settings bump it up to 110,110,120. Without knowing how those duals flow air along with a modified intake ,you may be lean.

If you lived near Minneapolis I'd Ibeat it for you and help ensure the bike performed correctly.

 

[XR750]

Thanks for the info guys. There is a mc dyno not too far away. Plan on doing a pull or two there after seat of pants dyno testing is complete.

 

[Fast1]

With a full Leo Vince system (minus the sparky) I set the fueling at 111,111,122 and there is no more deceleration popping. The SM630 really rips with the extra fuel and full Leo system. Will be doing some direct comparison runs against a 108,108,116 FMF slip on 630 soon. By just seat of the pants feel after swapping bikes, both of us agreed the Leo seemed to have a bit more punch.

 

[GeekVenture]

Just got the iBeat...I have the FMF slip on w/mid Ti pipe and sparky, stock air.
Once I figure out the software and where to plug it in at, what should I set it to?
108, 108, 116?

 

[DYNOBOB]

Those numbers should have you close. The third number (full throttle) is the one you don't want lean and could go anywhere from 116-122(?). A touch lean on the mid number (cruise) is not a bad thing. If your bike starts easily then the low number is close enough.

To All, If you go find a good dyno guy with a good sniffer you can optimize the low/mid settings for your bike in under an hour (take your laptop/iBeat of course). I stress good because those are the trickiest to get right (you're trusting their sniffer is accurate, their technique is good, you have no exhaust leaks, etc). Any dyno operator will easily find which full throttle setting is best because all your looking for is max power output (who cares what the sniffer says).

Reality is, the iBeat numbers we've talked about here are prob good enough for our mission.

.

 

[EricV]

Bob- I'm sure you get tired of this but if you don't mind my picking your brain a bit....

My 630 has about 8K on it now- PU kit done (of course), FMF single, airbox labyrinth removed, iridium plug, 14T CS...that's it. I'm right at about sea level here in central VA. The bike runs great- pulls great- but I do get very slight popping on decel and - here's the thing- it's very mildly hard to start (first crank of the day requires enrichener lever, even on a hot day, and a few revolutions of the engine to take off.) It's always been this way at start up when engine is cold, catches/starts quick hot. I just checked/set valves this past March.

If you have a recommendation of what I should set the 3 iBeat values to that would be great. In reading over the thread it's looking like I should have it at 108/108/116, but not sure if that applies to someone at sea level (and apologies if I've overlooked something.) Thanks!

 

[DYNOBOB]

Not tired at all

Yep, I'd use 108/108/116. Your elevation doesn't matter, the bike's sensors will adjust for that. If 108 on the low setting doesn't make it easier to start bump it up a little more (even 120 shouldn't hurt anything). Remember, all these numbers represent is the % you're adding to the stock (lean) base map.

.

 

[EricV]

Not tired at all

Yep, I'd use 108/108/116. Your elevation doesn't matter, the bike's sensors will adjust for that. If 108 on the low setting doesn't make it easier to start bump it up a little more (even 120 shouldn't hurt anything). Remember, all these numbers represent is the % you're adding to the stock (lean) base map.

.

You're a good sport- and fast with a response. Yep- duh- the elevation thing dates me to carbs for sure...I knew EFI would adjust and spaced on that fact. I'll definitely try 108/108/116 this weekend and will post back up to let others know how it worked out. Thanks!

 

[GeekVenture]

Thank you DynoBob!

@EricV and DynoBob: How can the bike adjust anymore since we have disconnected the O2 sensor via the PU kit?
I don't understand...I thought by doing this PU mod, we've disabled the bikes ability to adjust air/gas actively on the fly?

 

[DYNOBOB]

The PU kit resistor plug feeds the computer a value that locks it into "open loop" mode. The computer then fuels the bike from a fixed map based on the temp sensor, pressure sensor, TPS, etc. That map is very lean from the factory so we're increasing the fueling values across three different ranges with iBeat (or PCV, JD). It's my belief that big singles with the exhaust pipe out in the air flow are difficult to get to work right in "closed loop" mode w/ O2 (goofy O2 readings = goofy fueling).

I spent the day yesterday working on my buddy's 2014 TR650. Interestingly, the PCV for it unplugs the O2 with nothing plugged back in. It worked very well though.

.

 

[DYNOBOB]

TR650 results with and with out PCV.

TR650 vs. TE630

 

[GeekVenture]

I hope the TE's motor last as long as the TR's Rotax motor probably will

 

[SimpleOne]

Hi Guys,

I'm chasing some pearls of wisdom. Finally got the TE630 largely rebuilt, and now I'm setting about fandangling with things

I have the following bits:
1. FMF 4.1 Exhaust + Mid Pipe
2. PC V + AutoTune + Map Switch
3. PU Kit
4. Arrow ECU
5. iBeat

My plan is:
a) Use the stock ECU, is there any reason to use the Arrow instead if fuel mapping is going to be done with the PC V?
b) Set a baseline of 100/100/100 via iBeat and do the fuel tuning via the PC V, does that sound reasonable or should I use a different iBeat baseline for some reason?

A few questions further questions:

1. Does anyone know where I could get a PC V map that I can use for the TE 630 with the FMF 4.1 installed?
(my riding happens between 0-1800m above sea level [0 - 5900ft] and temps from -5c to 50c [23f to 122f])

2. How should I set up the autotune module since Dynojet say: "The Auto Tune kit can be configured to run and correct at all times or by using the "map switch port" on the PCV. You can set it up so that you can switch back and forth between the tuning modes and the base map settings."
To me it sounds like a should get a proper dyno tune done ($400 in my area) and then have the map switch configured to turn the AutoTune system on or off...Is that what most people have done, or am I wasting my money on the dyno tune?

Cheers

 

[Johnrg]

Regarding the PCV... A base dyno tune might be a good start but if you have Autotune you can adjust the percentage of change beforehand so it won't vary things beyond your set thresholds. Start with your stock ecu and allow it to adjust up to 20%. The bike will be running on the stock map and using the second bank for the trim table (using it as well). Later on accept the trims in software and send to the ECU. Next time you ride check the tables/trims again and accept. Eventually you'll have no more trims and thus have a good base map.

As far as the switch. It is very configurable but can be used in two ways basically. Turns autotune on and off. So if you are mapping at high elevations but were riding up from sea level and back down. You'de leave autotune off till at elevation, then shut off when heading back down to preserve the trims.

2nd way of the switch is between two maps.

You cannot run autotune and 2 maps since autotune acquires the second bank for live trim tables. You check checkboxes in the PC Software to enable Autotune as well as the switch functionality.

As far as maps, check dynojet.com for the model and kit. If they make a kit for the model they have map downloads on the bottom of the pages.

I had my bike dynoed as dynojet offered to do it for my bike since they didn't have kit for it. You can let Autotune do it and manually set your AFR and TPS as needed in software.

 

[SimpleOne]

Having watched this:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AOi9NHRv7jE


It doesn't mention in there the option to have AutoTune make automatic changes as you ride (in the video he talks about accepting the trim table changes into the base map when you come back from a ride). I have AutoTune enabled in the options, along with the autotune switch (input 1), but I can't work out which switch position is on and which is off just by looking at it. A few test rides will help clarify things, but I wont get a chance to do that till weekend after next. Is there some guru way to determine if AutoTune is running and actively making changes to the base map as you ride, do you just have to look and see if the base map has changed when you get back?

Or, am I wrong there, does autotune make 'as you ride changes' only by altering the trim table and applying it in real time over the base map, rather than actually changing the base map as you ride? (and leaving you with the option of permanently accepting the trim table changes into the base map only if you want to). This seems the more likely method to me, but I just want to make sure I understand how it should be working.

Also, whats a reasonable AFR to have AutoTune target? Most of my reading suggests 13.2, however is that an across the board target, or are there parts of the rev range (or throttle openings) where you would want it to target richer or leaner than this?

 

[mjskier]

Hi folks, picking up an 11 630 tomorrow. I'm trying to furiously catch up on the wisdom you guys have acquired :-)

So if I understand well:

- closed loop is crap. The o2 sensor is probably narrow band right?
- I could spend the money on PCV, or the JD kit equivalent.
- Or I could just get an iBeat cable/software and tinker with percentages in 3 areas (kind of like pilot needle and main on a carb?)
cheaper than the PCV or JD, but maybe not have the finer granularity or autotune capability of PCV?

- What else am I missing. The bike already has the o2 sensor eliminated, and some sort of aftermarket airbox with a membrane to let air in but not water. about 6k miles.
stock exhausts. I wouldn't mind going to a 1 can solution but they are pretty hard to find now. The only one I have seen is a powercore 4, and they sound way too loud!

Thanks for any suggestions.

 

[RDTCU]

Are you sure the bike doesn't already have a tuner?
And you can gut your stock cans for ~$50 in materials, if you go with some good perforated core. They'll save you a few pounds and sound great, but won't be as light as a single can.

 

[SilverBullet]

FMF Powercore 4 exhaust with the optional Quiet insert installed is not too loud. Wait until you pickup your bike and check for already installed tuner and maybe your stock exhausts have already been gutted. Very easy to tell by the heat output.

_

 

[mjskier]

Got the bike home and am going over it. No tuner, and unmodified stock cans.
I'll probably start down the iBeat path since the software and drivers are available at the right price (free )
Anybody has a dongle they don't use anymore and want to sell cheap?

 

[SimpleOne]

Here's some info I dug up from another forum regarding how AutoTune does indeed work:

Remember, if you have AutoTune turned on, the PC5 is running on the AFR table(s), not the Fuel table(s). I used to think the PC5 was running on the Fuel table(s) and just suggesting the changes needed (Trims) to match the AFR table(s).

If you not convinced, try this: While the bike is idling, dramatically lean or enrich the AFR table cells it's using (turn on tracing if you're unsure which cells to change) and send ONLY the AFR table to the PC5 - you'll immediately see the idle change. This proves that the bike is running on the AFR table(s) because no changes were made to Fuel table(s).

Now that I properly understand that, my plan is:
1. Get a proper dyno mapped tune done for my TE630 with the aim of the mapping being solely for maximum performance and to hell with fuel mileage. I'll use ZipTy's 630 map as the base then get the dyno boys to work from their with my particular bike to create the performance base map. (ZipTy's map can be found here: http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/zi...powercommander-5-race-maps.33459/#post-315951).
2. I will then use the switch mounted on the bars to turn AutoTune on or off. The AutoTune Target AFR table will be used for improving fuel mileage with leaner target AFR's in the low load (5-20% throttle openings) and at lower rev's (below 5 or 6k). I will probably get it to target around 13.7 (you could probably go leaner, but I'm going to err on the side of caution since there is bugger all chance of hearing pinging on the 630).

The alternative is get the dyno boys to do the second 'economy' map as well, and use the thumb switch to choose the maps as you want. This will cost more (a second dyno map in my area costs more than the AutoTune system), but has the advantage of not having the O2 sensor gumming up your exhaust flow, and also removing one extra point of possible failure. I might end up going down this path, but for the sake of trial and error I'm first going to see what results I can get with the AutoTune closed loop approach.