The CRM250AR was NOT an EFI'd / DFI'd bike. It had just your basic carb. Just click on the "history" link provided under the picture of the AR - you can find plenty of info about the "AR" part on the web. The last of the EXP400s were EFI - though, the EXP400 that Richard Sainct (sp? - edit - I always get this wrong - I 'think' it was Jean Brucy ????????? not Sainct) - I think it was he, but I'm not 100% sure - got 5th, I think, in a 90s (95?) edition of the Paris / Dakar was alternatively reported as being carb, then EFI'd, Carb'd, EFI'd, etc etc etc. The EXP400 used in the Nevada Rally was carbed, and was the first (public) version that basically had a CR500 based bottom end. That was reviewed / featured in Dirt Bike magazine. I think Bruce Ogilvy rode it in the Nevada Rally, and, perhaps the Baja 500 / 1000. Brucy's /Saincts Bike: The 400cc 2t had the same torque as the Works V Twin Honda 4t '750', with just a bit less horsepower, about 10HP less. Honda gave out something like 74HP and 70 /74 ft/lb ( or, I think, N /m) of torque. It weighed at least a 100lbs less, and used / carried, less fuel than the 4ts. It was widely held that Brucy was told to not win - instead, it went for the 'single cylinder' - or was it 'sub 500cc' class? win, and, of course, got it. So - a 2t, nearly 20 years ago - I'd put money on it / them being able to be taken out of the Honda museum, having a few updates, and walking all over the bikes in the forefront of Dakar, today. Then , think of what near 20 years of real development would have given us by today. Really, really give some thought to it. Hell, I 'd just like to see a couple of people use a 300 2t in the Dakar. Louis finished on a 150. A 300, should be a bit easier to do so with. Well, thinking on it - KTM, say, entering a DFI 2t, when they are about to finally release the only to be released when the legislators have the gun to our heads, DFI 2t (it's perfectly understandable, they are making so much profit from their 2 2t engine modules) is something that could happen - though, perhaps only in a fantasy land. Oh, note the clear upper fairing - something that has re-appeared with the latest Dakar Hondas, and KTMs. The 'Sloper' EFI / DFI engine in place: AR workings drawings and explanation: A patent drawing of one (there were many) version - a forward 'sloper': And, a reverse cylinder engine: I see various posts with people saying Honda are about to release a EFI / DFI 2t. Honda, obviously have thousands of designs / patents, that they have explored - they are , perhaps, the ultimate ICE Engineering company. But, Honda, since day one, have been a 4T company. Yes, the very first full Honda MC had a 2t engine, but Soichiro (sp?) himself, hated them, and went directly to 4ts. The only reason they made 2ts after that, was due to the '70s dirt bike explosion, and the need for them to win, and, of course, get sales. Thus, the Elsinores were surreptitiusly developed as "Lawn Mowers", until they were show to Soichiro, almost as a 'faite au compli' - many here will know of this. Then, of course, after the humiliation of the NR500, the Oval pistoned, double conrod, 8valve per cylinder faux V8 ( 4 cylinders only were allowed, and 4t / any engine, had to be within 500cc for 500cc racing), Honda brought out the Triple, then the Four Cylinder 2t GP bikes. In every step of the 4t 'revolution' there has been Honda's hand - the manipulation of rules that enabled 4ts to become competitive = ' handicap ' rules, doubling capacity. Honda had set in stone, that they would cease 2t production by 2007 - and that, they did. People who called themselves 'journalists' seemed to be unaware that was Hondas schedule / plan, set many, many years earlier. I'd be stunned if Honda ever brought out a 2t again. But, you never know - if equivalency became a hard and fast rule throughout the entirety of racing, And 2ts for general use became more common, thus dominating sales, they may do another CR / RS capitulation to the basic better solution a 2t is, for ICE powerplants. But Honda are at the forefront of stopping equivalency. I honestly believe that 4ts, would become / should become, redundant dinosaurs of the ICE age. Modern , naturally aspirated 2ts, have the ability to far surpass 4ts. And, even if turbo charged / supercharged 4ts re-appear - and there are several 'show' bikes / engines doing the rounds currently, those same techs can be applied to 2ts. And no, I'm Not a 4t hater - I've more of them than 2ts. I just believe 2ts hold far more advantages / potential over 4ts, for ICE applications - in all forms of vehicles. Oh - something I've noticed lately: I'm supremely non ' E Techy', not even owning a smart phone, but I see all these new Power Packs etc - small units that people can use to re charge 'phones / Puters, and Start Vehicles with dead batteries. Some units, barely over the size of a pack of cigarettes / an Ipad Mini, can reputedly start a car / truck, many, many times over. I can see that as the sort of thing that many would find useful - not the least those who have an E Start only bike. If I were in that position, I'd certainly own / carry one. They are cheaper than having a decent quality lead acid spare battery, let alone a LiPO, or whatever those trick, lightweight batteries are that people upgrade to.
I thought I better correct my mistakes - the Works 780 (probably bigger) 4t V Twin, had 71PS, the 402cc 2t had 54PS. A 'PS", is just a poofteenth less than a HP - so, 54PS, is just below 53.3 HP. Check the spec plate at the end of the video. 1995, with 54PS, at 7000 RPM. Somewhat understressed, methinks. And, the torque for both, was 58lbft. Though, the HP and Torque numbers I put up previously, were quoted in a variety of articles. A bit 'ambitous' , though. Hondas museum plate, is a bit more accurate, I'd say. The weight difference, was 118lbs. It was said this gave the 402cc 2t, the same power to weight ratio, as the 780 4t V Twin. Here's a brief 'walk around' video of this magnificent motorcycle, from 1995. : View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fujf6cHFB6Q Give thought to just what we could be riding, without Hondas "all 4t , all the time" ethos, and their machinations that have so perverted nearly all types of Motorcycle racing, and the market. Take it out of the museum, with a few updates (hey, they are using the clear top fairing idea this year, both Honda and KTM), and put an 'Alien' on it, and a 20 year old bike, would have a very good chance at trouncing the 450 4ts.
you guys are so far off topic.... I was looking for a 2014 Sherco 450 and find a 1990s Honda rally bike....cmon all focus or make a new thread.
Why? Then he would know we (I) want the Sherco 175. This site gets a lot of traffic for the off brands, would be smart for importers to read what people think here and get a feel for the wants of the customer.
He knows. Several people from here wrote over there. It seems possibly 2015 though. I'm sure he's tracking this too as this was mentioned over there. Whatever company makes a 175 first is going to get big quick
Its a perfect size for many of us tight technical riders. Many say why not a KTM 200 but you ride one back to back with the husky 125/144/165 and you get it. The small crank is everything for me. The 165 is almost perfect for me as would be a 175. It will be interesting to see if the Sherco 175 happens and if it will be a new smaller motor or based on the 250 (which is what I would assume cost wise). Good times / fun choices.
He very might be looking in from the Bat Cave... I think Clay would lose his mind, when a Sherco thread devolves like this though.....
WHERE?? WHAT COUNT? BUMP IT UP TO 105 CAFE SHERCO IS NOT NEARLY AS KOOL .THIS PLACE THE LAY OUT,DECOR,SERVICE,CLIENTELE, PRICES THE COFFEE ALL SUPERIOR AT CAFE HUSKY IMHO O AND MARRY CHRISTMAS EVERYBODY
Roses are red and violets are blue. Wait is that, Husky's were red and Sherco's are blue? Yes # 106, like to have a 175. Guess we are Shercounting on it to happen.
if they make it kick start only & it doesn't weigh a metric tonne(haha) id go one-they look real purdy & nimble too. #107
Hey, sorry for the "thread jack", but, someone else brought up AR Hondas, and I had to correct the mistake about EFI / DFI. Then, I fell back in lust with the EXP2, then had to correct my own mistakes ............ And, I do like to 'expose' people to things they may not know to have existed. Back to the Sherco 450 - it will be interesting to see / ride this new - as I gather it is - 450 and up engine. Previous ones I've ridden have been fine engines / bikes overall, and Sherco Enduro bikes have really impressed me since I first came into contact with then in 06.
