2009 Baja 1000

[LRPct]

I realize that I have crossed the line into ranting. Sorry for the feeble display of bravado. Let me explain my passion on this topic.

1.)As a young rider I dreamed of winning Baja someday. Back in that time only two riders were allowed per team and the bikes were dodgy at best;trying to hold one together for 1000 miles was a small miracle. I broke down in my first three Baja attempts two times never even seeing the bike.

2.) Baja for me was the truest test of man and machine. Starting and finishing on the same bike was at the core of the race. Just to finish was a remarkable accomplishment(rember only two riders per team) and since in the early years I built my own bikes I was very respectful of the hard work and dedication that took.

3.) I know what it feels like to have a fellow competitor switch bikes. It sucks! That has always stuck with me.

4.) Even in the amateur ranks; if a motorcyle/car/truck/atv continues racing after it is technically disqualified then it affects everyone else in the race:
Every driver/rider that had to pass/negotiate/take into account the "replacement" bike. Every course marshall, flagger, score keeper, sweep crew that had to account for the bike. Almost everyone in the event is affected at one level or another. Baja Racing/Off Road Racing is like an all day long plane crash, a billion different seperate events and yet all connected.

5.) I'm sorry LRP if I offended you in any way. You seem to be coming from a good place in the heart. I respect your right to your opinion. I hope you know my last post was an attempt at humor. This rant isn't about any individual or team its about a behavior and a way of making sense out of what small affairs in the world we can control like a so called sporting event.

6.) I'm just not sure I want to live in a world that wants to cut corners off what a finish, or may you be ever so blessed an overall victory may actually mean in terms of a sense of accomplishment. Anything that diminishes that I am against.

I copy that and respect your opinion and feeling and can understand where you are coming from. Just like I was saying, I was talking about in an DFL, "laps down" while BEING HONEST about it situation. I understand you're concerns about "lapper" in the way and what can happen. I've been both lapper and the lappee in different situations while dicing for a win or position.
In my first race ever at Laguna Seca in the first 2 laps I lost both my mirrors. One from car contact, one from the glass just vibrating out. It also happened to be the first car race that I ever had a brain fart that affected someone else. I outbraked myself in T11 and ran into the car in front of me. It caused him to only lose about a second or two, but caused me about 20 seconds as I navigated the runoff area. I still felt sooo very bad about it for the other driver and apoligized a dozen times.

Being my first time at the track, and being 1 -2 seconds off the pace and with that mistake, it did'nt take all that long for lappers to be approaching me. With no mirrors to gauge where they were, and being in an already hard enough to see out of formula car I pulled in and ended my own race.

Did I have the right to stay out there? Sure. I would have if I did have mirrors. So, to your point about "lappers" affecting a race I see your valid point. I've just always just thought of them as another part of racing. As long as they/I are responsible about it.

Nobody EVER has the right to break the rules and claim a win or position. I think we see the same on that.

I was just saying, that if someone wanted to say to me, "yeah we finshed the race, the 1000, or whatever, but we switched bikes so it doesn't "count" But we still feel good about making it and had a good experience even though it DOES NOT count as a result" I'd be fine with THAT...

We're not THAT far off from one another's thinking anyway after all Relic.. no harm no foul.. keep riding

 

[rajobigguy]

This has been an interesting debate. I originally had the opinion that since there was no attempted fraud (my opinion) then then there was really no harm. Then under closer consideration I took the opinion that the biggest fault was not contacting SCORE officials with concise details about the intent of switching bikes simply to ride at the course in a non competitive fashion. Then something that Husky Relic said got me to thinking, if a bike on a closed track breaks down they don't get to go grab another bike and keep riding just for the joy of it, you're either competing or you get off the track so as not to potentially impair other competitors. Then I read Husky Relics last post and he pretty much confirmed what I was thinking.

Scott:
Thanks for keeping the compass pointed in the right direction, it's good to have someone like you at the helm.

 

[LRPct]

This has been an interesting debate. I originally had the opinion that since there was no attempted fraud (my opinion) then then there was really no harm. Then under closer consideration I took the opinion that the biggest fault was not contacting SCORE officials with concise details about the intent of switching bikes simply to ride at the course in a non competitive fashion. Then something that Husky Relic said got me to thinking, if a bike on a closed track breaks down they don't get to go grab another bike and keep riding just for the joy of it, you're either competing or you get off the track so as not to potentially impair other competitors. Then I read Husky Relics last post and he pretty much confirmed what I was thinking.

Scott:
Thanks for keeping the compass pointed in the right direction, it's good to have someone like you at the helm.

Like I just said I too see that position. And dealing with lappers or what ever is not fun, wether cause of a break down or being just plain slow. I'm just more liberal about it I guess though. If you can be lapped without taking someone else out, have at it and have a good time. It you're not capable of being passed or lapped without crashing or affecting someone else so very negatively, well then, you're proablly infamous and easy to spot. Just my way of thinking though, no one else has to suscribe to it. If someone cheats, I'll throw the book at them. But I won't chastize them and accuse them of being an "evil" person. Just make sure they are held fully accountable.

What if someone didn't cheat, they are just slow and they crash you out as you go by. Are you gonna cuss them out forever and put curses on their children because they ruined your race?? I'd be wicked pissed and disappointed but I wouldn't do that. Just like I wouldn't curse the capable rider riding miles behind me on a different bike now after a break down who is just now there for the experience, not for a claim to a position.

Lappers are a valid concern either way, but they're always just been another facet and obstacle in racing to me. But I can see how others see differently. Hopefully people can just be responsible about it and make sure it can't affect others TOO much...

 

[Colo moto]

As a member of team 349x I feel I need to chime in. While I was over 150 race miles away and out of radio contact when the decision to switch bikes took place, and thus had no part in making that decision, I do need to accept responsibility for our race effort.

As part of a team I had a responsibility to make sure the bike was in race condition, and that we were ready to make a well prepared and safe run at the baja 1000. As far as I know it is still not 100% clear what exactly happened that caused the 510 to break down. Regardless, I was helping to prepare the 510 the day before the race and I should have either caught the problem, or done a better job preparing the bike. I will accept full responsibility for the 510 breaking down.

The second thing that could have prevented this whole ordeal would have been proper communication equipment. Had every rider had a satellite phone we would have been able to communicate and spare parts could have been called in. At the very least we could have come to a decision as a team. Had I better anticipated the need for satellite phones I would have gotten them.

I would like to apologize to the rest of the team, to Cafe Husky and to every other husky enthusiast for not doing a better job of preparing for the race. I am sure every husky enthusiast would have liked to see a husky finish the race.

It is worth mentioning that team 349x was purely a privateer effort. Neither Husqvarna NA nor Cafe Husky had any connection to our race team.

With that out of the way I will try to explain why changing bikes and re entering the race is a no no. It seems that everyone has a slightly different take on race ethics, the spirit of competition and respect for the rules of competition. I won't attempt to explain from a racers point of view why it is important to respect these things, even when the overall finish is irrelevant. Perhaps an even more important reason not to re enter a race like the Baja 1000 is safety. It takes an incredible amount of man hours and resources to track and locate racers. By re entering a race on a bike that will eventually be disqualified anyway, one is using up resources that need to be used for the others still legally in the race. Should something go wrong and you need to be found or rescued precious resources are being used to locate and/or rescue a rider who should not even be there in the first place.

Sorry for the long post, and thanks for taking the time to read it.


Clay Hamilton

 

[Motosportz]

As a member of team 349x I feel I need to chime in. While I was over 150 race miles away and out of radio contact when the decision to switch bikes took place, and thus had no part in making that decision, I do need to accept responsibility for our race effort.

As part of a team I had a responsibility to make sure the bike was in race condition, and that we were ready to make a well prepared and safe run at the baja 1000. As far as I know it is still not 100% clear what exactly happened that caused the 510 to break down. Regardless, I was helping to prepare the 510 the day before the race and I should have either caught the problem, or done a better job preparing the bike. I will accept full responsibility for the 510 breaking down.

The second thing that could have prevented this whole ordeal would have been proper communication equipment. Had every rider had a satellite phone we would have been able to communicate and spare parts could have been called in. At the very least we could have come to a decision as a team. Had I better anticipated the need for satellite phones I would have gotten them.

I would like to apologize to the rest of the team, to Cafe Husky and to every other husky enthusiast for not doing a better job of preparing for the race. I am sure every husky enthusiast would have liked to see a husky finish the race.

It is worth mentioning that team 349x was purely a privateer effort. Neither Husqvarna NA nor Cafe Husky had any connection to our race team.

With that out of the way I will try to explain why changing bikes and re entering the race is a no no. It seems that everyone has a slightly different take on race ethics, the spirit of competition and respect for the rules of competition. I won't attempt to explain from a racers point of view why it is important to respect these things, even when the overall finish is irrelevant. Perhaps an even more important reason not to re enter a race like the Baja 1000 is safety. It takes an incredible amount of man hours and resources to track and locate racers. By re entering a race on a bike that will eventually be disqualified anyway, one is using up resources that need to be used for the others still legally in the race. Should something go wrong and you need to be found or rescued precious resources are being used to locate and/or rescue a rider who should not even be there in the first place.

Sorry for the long post, and thanks for taking the time to read it.


Clay Hamilton

Good stuff Clay. Honest and to the point. Sorry you guys did not have a better go of it. Maybe next time.

 

[Norman Foley]

Clay,
Thanks for filling us in. I hope you get another shot at Baja.

 

[Husky Relic]

As a member of team 349x I feel I need to chime in. While I was over 150 race miles away and out of radio contact when the decision to switch bikes took place, and thus had no part in making that decision, I do need to accept responsibility for our race effort.

As part of a team I had a responsibility to make sure the bike was in race condition, and that we were ready to make a well prepared and safe run at the baja 1000. As far as I know it is still not 100% clear what exactly happened that caused the 510 to break down. Regardless, I was helping to prepare the 510 the day before the race and I should have either caught the problem, or done a better job preparing the bike. I will accept full responsibility for the 510 breaking down.

The second thing that could have prevented this whole ordeal would have been proper communication equipment. Had every rider had a satellite phone we would have been able to communicate and spare parts could have been called in. At the very least we could have come to a decision as a team. Had I better anticipated the need for satellite phones I would have gotten them.

I would like to apologize to the rest of the team, to Cafe Husky and to every other husky enthusiast for not doing a better job of preparing for the race. I am sure every husky enthusiast would have liked to see a husky finish the race.

It is worth mentioning that team 349x was purely a privateer effort. Neither Husqvarna NA nor Cafe Husky had any connection to our race team.

With that out of the way I will try to explain why changing bikes and re entering the race is a no no. It seems that everyone has a slightly different take on race ethics, the spirit of competition and respect for the rules of competition. I won't attempt to explain from a racers point of view why it is important to respect these things, even when the overall finish is irrelevant. Perhaps an even more important reason not to re enter a race like the Baja 1000 is safety. It takes an incredible amount of man hours and resources to track and locate racers. By re entering a race on a bike that will eventually be disqualified anyway, one is using up resources that need to be used for the others still legally in the race. Should something go wrong and you need to be found or rescued precious resources are being used to locate and/or rescue a rider who should not even be there in the first place.

Sorry for the long post, and thanks for taking the time to read it.


Clay Hamilton

Thanks Clay for filling us in on your effort. I was sorry to see that you guys didn't finish. The first three bikes I prepared for the Baja 500 and 1000 didn't finish either so I know the feeling. I think you'll learn from the experience and come back better prepared next time. I sincerely appreciate your honesty about the "second" bike incident. I never meant my remarks to be taken personally I was just speaking up for the integrity of the event. I am very proud that all of you chose to ride a Husqvarna. I respect an awful lot the hard work the team put in. I hope we can be more involved in the future.

 

[Mike Kay]

Intersting reading.

Gotta love the internet. Charged, tried and convicted all from behind a keyboard...and on the use of two words:

SWITCHED BIKES.

No, friends, we didnt switch bikes. Nope. Nice try.

Everyone on here is writing with the presumption that this is what happened.

Since i was the only person involved, allow me to tell you what happened:

We where out of the race very early on with a mechanical. We got to our broken bike in a chase truck, during a lull in the racing--the 2 hour window between the bikes and trucks. We made an extraction plan, based on what was the safest way to proceed. Chase truck went on a secondary road to the coast and ensenada. Dual sport bike went out on the course to find the rest of the team. Dual sport bike waited until all bikes had gone thru. Trucks and fast cars had gone thru. A few stock volkswagons, side by sides still racing, and of course a hand full of 4x4's that had broken down earlier were still on the course, but very few. Attention was payed not to negatively influence these vehicles.

349x then had a Chase Bike on the course for a short time, and at the same time, several chase trucks all over the desert. Numbers intentionally put on the bike, same as on all chase trucks, for identification, for safety, etc. Bike rode a short distance looking for team members. Stopped along the way checking status. Plan was to have this chase bike ride several hours, notifying the team at various positions of what was going on, preferably with 2-3 riders handing off in this chore.
Team 349x eventually used 4 chase bikes by the time all was said and done, all riding the course, including 3 Huskys and a Honda, chasing and looking for each other. Not 2 bikes.
I was on one of those chase bikes. I saw dozens of other bikes, quads and 4x4's--going in both directions--on the course, doing the same thing--looking for broken down bikes, trucks, or whatever. Its a 100% natural and normal proceedure at any large Baja race. Ive done it dozens of times, since 1974, when i chased my dad at the baja 500.

Thats it.

Accusing 349x of RACING two bikes is UNACCEPTABLE.

I have a stiff middle finger for you if thats the kind of internet rumor YOU are spreading. Reading Honda fans on TT posting this is not surprising. Reading Husky fans posting this is not acceptable.

Accusing 349x of breaking any rules is absurd, its crazy. Anyone saying we raced 2 bikes is simply ignorant, or intentionally misleading with a hidden agenda, or not so hidden agenda.

We were DNFed out on time long before we rode our chase bikes. I personally communicated what we where doing to SCORE officials, pit teams, and at KM77 local fans. I also called my wife via Sat phone and explained to her what was going on, and she attempted to contact other team mates to help communicate. We where just guys riding on an empty course, well after 99% of the race traffic had passed, looking for each other. Like HUNDREDS of other fans, chasers, broken down racers, all riding around, etc.

In no way did any racer ever suffer any dust, slowing down, danger, etc from our effort.

On the contrary. I spent over an hour with a broken class 8 truck and helped them get going again. I also stopped and helped 2 other broken down race cars. I also helped a tired and confused ironman rider from Japan.

Sadly our attempts to finish the 1000 failed with an early mechanical failure, related to our clutch: a well known weakness of many Husqvarna motorcycles. It was not the first time i was on a team that DNFed a Husky thanks to the lame clutch design. Sadly one of our 3 Husky chase bikes also broke down--directly related to a poor harness routing from the factory.

610 owners should check the wire harness at it approaches the fuses, and zip tye it to the sub frame so it doesnt rub against the battery, and fray wires.

Husky owners should check the facts before buying into internet rumors.

This site is supposed to be above this kind of crap.

---------
Ive contacted SCORE and asked them if it was true 349x was "being investigated" as reported by another website, by the so called moderator no less. They looked it up.
349x status is DNF. Nothing else.

I then had to listen to 5 minutes of SCORE official telling me about internet rumors, and how much bunk gets written, and how tired they are of it, and that they dont pay attention to it. I had a great laugh and agreed whole heartedly. We decided the guys who write this weigh 350lbs, live in Barstow, dont race, and have wives who weigh 450lbs.

At least ive found out who my friends are. Gotto go tear up that Christmas Card for Husky North America.

 

[Mike Kay]

This is the problem with America today. Rumors from guys who should no better, who are at the top of the pile and should act accordingly, but dont.

NOBODY SWITCHED BIKES.

Please refrain from backhanded swipes at me, its a form of personal attack.

Switching bikes is against the rules. It is a major infraction and cannot be condoned or excused under any circumstance. It degrades the spirit of the competition and the honor and sense of achievement of those that play be the rules get from simply finishing.

I'm not certain what happened in the case of 349X and I don't want to know. This isn't just about 349X.

In my view there is only one way to approach this subject. With Integrity. I've been told integrity is doing the right thing even when no one is looking.

I have had teams switch bikes on me in compeition and nothing gets me more upset. I don't want to hear "we were out of the race anyway" and "it wouldn't matter, no one would care". It does matter and I care if no one else. It's Baja and it's "Man and Machine" (not "Machines") or so I've been told.

Scot

 

[life_in_sepia]

Thanks Mike. I'm sorry that I assumed what others purported to confirm, after investigation, as fact. I should have known better and have prefaced my defense of the attack on your integrity with, "even assuming the allegations are true...." These allegations seem to be the proverbial "making a mountain out of a mole hill."

 

[Husky Relic]

This is the problem with America today. Rumors from guys who should no better, who are at the top of the pile and should act accordingly, but dont.

NOBODY SWITCHED BIKES.

Please refrain from backhanded swipes at me, its a form of personal attack.

Dear Mike,

If you read my posts you will find the following.

I'm not certain what happened in the case of 349X and I don't want to know. This isn't just about 349X.

This rant isn't about any individual or team its about a behavior and a way of making sense out of what small affairs in the world we can control like a so called sporting event.

My only purpose is to speak out in the interest of fair play and the sporting spirit and a code of conduct amongst off road racers.

So, please 349X and the members of that team please don't read anymore than this into my original post. This isn't about you specifically.
It only allows me to discuss the topic. Hope to see you guys back down in Baja again. I'm sure you will find success next time!

I never meant my remarks to be taken personally I was just speaking up for the integrity of the event. I am very proud that all of you chose to ride a Husqvarna. I respect an awful lot the hard work the team put in. I hope we can be more involved in the future.

I used the opportunity to discuss an important topic. When I noticed some people were taking the discussion the wrong way I tried to refocus the discussion back on the behavior or the act of using two bikes in the same race and not a specific individual or team.

Please read my final comment one more time, I meant every word. I apologize if my comments offended you in any way. This discussion was about behavior and not individuals. I'm sorry if anyone took it any other way.

Scot

 

[letitsnow]

Intersting reading.

Gotta love the internet. Charged, tried and convicted all from behind a keyboard...and on the use of two words:

SWITCHED BIKES.

No, friends, we didnt switch bikes. Nope. Nice try.

Everyone on here is writing with the presumption that this is what happened.

Since i was the only person involved, allow me to tell you what happened:

We where out of the race very early on with a mechanical. We got to our broken bike in a chase truck, during a lull in the racing--the 2 hour window between the bikes and trucks. We made an extraction plan, based on what was the safest way to proceed. Chase truck went on a secondary road to the coast and ensenada. Dual sport bike went out on the course to find the rest of the team. Dual sport bike waited until all bikes had gone thru. Trucks and fast cars had gone thru. A few stock volkswagons, side by sides still racing, and of course a hand full of 4x4's that had broken down earlier were still on the course, but very few. Attention was payed not to negatively influence these vehicles.

349x then had a Chase Bike on the course for a short time, and at the same time, several chase trucks all over the desert. Numbers intentionally put on the bike, same as on all chase trucks, for identification, for safety, etc. Bike rode a short distance looking for team members. Stopped along the way checking status. Plan was to have this chase bike ride several hours, notifying the team at various positions of what was going on, preferably with 2-3 riders handing off in this chore.
Team 349x eventually used 4 chase bikes by the time all was said and done, all riding the course, including 3 Huskys and a Honda, chasing and looking for each other. Not 2 bikes.
I was on one of those chase bikes. I saw dozens of other bikes, quads and 4x4's--going in both directions--on the course, doing the same thing--looking for broken down bikes, trucks, or whatever. Its a 100% natural and normal proceedure at any large Baja race. Ive done it dozens of times, since 1974, when i chased my dad at the baja 500.

Thats it.

Accusing 349x of RACING two bikes is UNACCEPTABLE.

I have a stiff middle finger for you if thats the kind of internet rumor YOU are spreading. Reading Honda fans on TT posting this is not surprising. Reading Husky fans posting this is not acceptable.

Accusing 349x of breaking any rules is absurd, its crazy. Anyone saying we raced 2 bikes is simply ignorant, or intentionally misleading with a hidden agenda, or not so hidden agenda.

We were DNFed out on time long before we rode our chase bikes. I personally communicated what we where doing to SCORE officials, pit teams, and at KM77 local fans. I also called my wife via Sat phone and explained to her what was going on, and she attempted to contact other team mates to help communicate. We where just guys riding on an empty course, well after 99% of the race traffic had passed, looking for each other. Like HUNDREDS of other fans, chasers, broken down racers, all riding around, etc.

In no way did any racer ever suffer any dust, slowing down, danger, etc from our effort.

On the contrary. I spent over an hour with a broken class 8 truck and helped them get going again. I also stopped and helped 2 other broken down race cars. I also helped a tired and confused ironman rider from Japan.

Sadly our attempts to finish the 1000 failed with an early mechanical failure, related to our clutch: a well known weakness of many Husqvarna motorcycles. It was not the first time i was on a team that DNFed a Husky thanks to the lame clutch design. Sadly one of our 3 Husky chase bikes also broke down--directly related to a poor harness routing from the factory.

610 owners should check the wire harness at it approaches the fuses, and zip tye it to the sub frame so it doesnt rub against the battery, and fray wires.

Husky owners should check the facts before buying into internet rumors.

This site is supposed to be above this kind of crap.

---------
Ive contacted SCORE and asked them if it was true 349x was "being investigated" as reported by another website, by the so called moderator no less. They looked it up.
349x status is DNF. Nothing else.

I then had to listen to 5 minutes of SCORE official telling me about internet rumors, and how much bunk gets written, and how tired they are of it, and that they dont pay attention to it. I had a great laugh and agreed whole heartedly. We decided the guys who write this weigh 350lbs, live in Barstow, dont race, and have wives who weigh 450lbs.

At least ive found out who my friends are. Gotto go tear up that Christmas Card for Husky North America.

450 lb wife? I will never complain again...

 

[Coffee]

This thread is beginning to bother me.

I spent a considerable amount of time on the phone with multiple people getting an extremely clear understanding of what was happened down there.

What is being typed in this thread has been changing as time progresses - and I really don't like that. The longer this thread gets, the farther from what I was told happened down there is being typed - and peoples stories are now diverging.

I am *not* referring to 1 person. at least 2, maybe 3.

The only conclusion I can come up with is what happened cannot be logically explained.



It is my hope this thread can stay open so if people feel the need to say something they can. It would be good to let this topic rest if you can.

 

[BlipBlip!]

After reading the above post in this thread a few things should be said… and no I had nothing to do with this Baja effort!

First, I’d just like to say thanks to all those who took part in the privateer Husqvarna team 349x… I know a lot of time, money and enthusiasm went into the project, unfortunately things didn’t go the way they could have and the race ended when it did…. S#it happens.

I’ve also been following comments in this thread as well as others on the web and to say I’m disgusted would be an understatement. For whatever the reason, it’s the same haters year after year who start the negative threads and contribute to these post….. Why? Because they can and that’s what Baja forums seem to be all about anymore.

I’ve also read comments here that have me shaken my head, I would have thought that people from our own community would have taken the high road and just say thanks and left it at that.

When I think of Baja, the memory of the original movie “On Any Sunday.” come to mind with images of Malcolm Smith and Steve McQueen.

Yes, a lot of things have changed since Malcolm Smith first ran the Baja 1000 back in 1967 on an air cooled short travel suspension Husqvarna.

Back then it was a real challenge and the conveniences we have today like Medivac Helicopters, Satellite phones, GPS tracking and the INTERNET just to name a few a weren’t even options to those early racers.

The only thing still the same is the desire by many to experience the challenge we all know as Baja… and from the sound of what’s been posted it seems that is just what happened…. A bunch of guys just wanted to be part of something that many of us just dream of.

After reading the above thread as well as posts on other web forums I thought that I’d like to say something.

We (As in the Husqvarna community) have strong bonds to the Husqvarna brand! We also have vivid memories of Husqvarna’s 20 year Baja domination which ended in 1987 with Dan Smith’s retirement.

Since then it’s become a Honda thing, with a very loyal Honda fraternity who have all been brain washed that Baja is theirs!

I’ve watched these same people over the years snipe at anything not Honda as well as anyone they deem an out cast from their Honda community.

It’s funny how out of the hundred or more motorcycles and quads that DNF this years Baja 1000… 99% of those machines were Honda’s, but if you read any of the discussions on any of the Baja forums the focus is about a privateer Husqvarna effort, put together by a very loyal group of long time Husqvarna enthusiast from OUR OWN Husqvarna community.

While things didn’t go as planned, I still have to commend those that took part in this effort and say a BIG THANKS to my Husqvarna brothers for making the effort!

For all those casting doubt and or changing their alliance to the cause, I’m sorry and I’d like to post how I feel, but I’m afraid those words as well as this post would be deleted.

BlipBlip/HuskyRips.

Now back to my SELF imposed exile on Thumpertalk!

 

[Norman Foley]

Welcome back and don't be a stranger! Kawi had a little stint in Baja and they're back up front. Husky needs to be back up front too (And all through the pack).