Isn't it a shame that Husqvarna or who ever it is, TM or Gas Gas and or Sherco believes in Physics, brilliant engineering not to mention art as it applies to mechanical forms only to be compared to a Suzuki 400 enduro model. The engineering staff at BMW-Husqvarnz must be scratching their heads, thinking to themselves that the Masters Degree they have is worth no more than a trip to the nearest ATV park concession stand. Remember not so many yrs. ago all the testers said KTM's were junk cause of their PDS suspension, lord have mercy the hand wringing that followed; now well now it's cool. I enjoy the tests on any bike in any Mag or Blog but Come on a Suzuki 400, sour grapes. This has been fun, now let's give Chilly White some kindness.
-
Hi everyone,
As you all know, Coffee (Dean) passed away a couple of years ago. I am Dean's ex-wife's husband and happen to have spent my career in tech. Over the years, I occasionally helped Dean with various tech issues.
When he passed, I worked with his kids to gather the necessary credentials to keep this site running. Since then (and for however long they worked with Coffee), Woodschick and Dirtdame have been maintaining the site and covering the costs. Without their hard work and financial support, CafeHusky would have been lost.
Over the past couple of weeks, I’ve been working to migrate the site to a free cloud compute instance so that Woodschick and Dirtdame no longer have to fund it. At the same time, I’ve updated the site to a current version of XenForo (the discussion software it runs on). The previous version was outdated and no longer supported.
Unfortunately, the new software version doesn’t support importing the old site’s styles, so for now, you’ll see the XenForo default style. This may change over time.
Coffee didn’t document the work he did on the site, so I’ve been digging through the old setup to understand how everything was running. There may still be things I’ve missed. One known issue is that email functionality is not yet working on the new site, but I hope to resolve this over time.
Thanks for your patience and support!
Enduro 360 tests the TE511
- Thread starter Norman Foley
- Start date
I just read Chillies review.
Seems pretty level headed. I'm pretty familiar with magazine tests, that amount to only the most cursory of rides, especially if the bike is at all different / not the flavour of the month. I've worked in the MC industry, with duties of prepping bikes for testing, years ago, and was appauled when I saw tests of bikes I was involved with, that were given 1 or 2 laps around an MX track. And even test sessions where I saw riders Not ride the bike in question, then be quoted on their opinions of the bike.
It happens.
So, at least Chilly has ridden the bike, for a while - in his words.
I Don't Own a Husky, nor did I own a BMW 450. But, I've ridden them a reasonable amount, and helped mates set theirs up, and 2 of them have had successive BM/Huskies. It's why I've regularly gone after the fools that join in , in trashing the BM / Husky. The majority haven't ridden them, or still have their noses out of joint that DK couldn't ride the bike/ could not stick with the job he was hired for. Good on him, I say, he realised he wasn't a development rider, and walked away from what appeared to be a big bucks deal. Juha, stayed with it, and, got the same placing - 2nd in E2, in the EWC, in 2009, as he did in 2008, on a KTM. It's strange how people don't know that..... He broke his ankle, in early 2010 - I guess that may be a reason to dislike the BM /Husky, too.
They Are a rather different bike, it's undeniable. But, take a bit of time, learn to set them up, and they are Good things.
The vibration problem , IS bloody weird. the 511 /450s I've ridden, were as smooth as silk. The fellow that pointed out the pipe interference issue, might just have it sorted. It's the type of thing that has happened to many bikes. I've come across this on several KTMs, and many other bikes, over the years. That it has gradually improved, for Chilly, might indicate it's 'worn' enough of the pipe / frame - or , the accessory pipe fits a damned sight better! No excuse for parts hitting. I hope that Husky have been made aware that this could be the problem - but it's the sort of thing they should pick up on, at the factory, at the distributors, at a dealership - especially if it's just a matter of correct fitment, as it quite often is, on many bikes.
Just a note about the std Muffler - when I first saw pictures of it, I thought it had to be a photo shop job on it. I even put that up on a thread in KTM Talk. It's the most ridicoulous things I've ever seen. Not that I've ever seen the monstrosity in real life - I've only got near the TEs, with Akros on it - here in OZ, I think you get an Akro with the purchase of the bike? That size, with a CAT - would account for most of the weight it has over the KTM EXC.
By the way - if you tried to ride a KTM EXC, in its std, road legal form, as it comes in OZ, it's quite a pig of a thing, too. As are all ADR'd bikes. So, we are All crims here (don't go there with the Convict jibes, boys) in OZ, as if you modify a bike to perform well, it's no longer legal to ride it, on the street / trails of OZ.
I'm far from appreciative of the body work. But I've disliked Husky styling for quite a while, well before the 449 /511. Reduce the amount of radiator shrouds, Husky, and get rid of that 'no side plate styling, that KTM brought to market. At Least KTM have seen the error of their ways. Bizarely, I like the front fender, not for its looks (yuck!), but for how it works. If I could get an Acerbis, UFO, other brand, single colour / piece replica, I'd put one on my bike.
Not being able to pick the front end up? I don't know what to say. I've not experienced that one. Weirder, than weird. Some drongos have gone on about the reverse rotation of the engine, being a problem, but, by my calculations, I think it adds about 350 grams downward force, at full revs, probably even less - my Maths skills are a bit rusty, so, I'm erring to a higher figure. Add in the different, non squat feel to the rear end, and I can see some finding it quite strange, though
Now, I may be ahead of the curve on CTS type back ends, having used a Torque Eliminator set up on many of my bikes, over the years. I like the neutrality of CTS / Anti Chain Torque / pull rear ends. But, a Vast amount of riders, have ridden nothing but, a std rear end, with it's constantly varying chain torque, and have learned its ways, pretty much, unconciously. To go to a CTS, is something, that some, may never be able to do.
Fair Enough.
Much like a PDS rear end, but, more markedly so, it requires set up, different to the norm. No 100mm of rider sag, 30 /35mm (or whatever) unladen sag.
I've found, that you need to use different 'settings'. A heavier spring, with more laden, and unladen sag, in the rear. With CTS / Anti chain torque devices, you don't have the 'stiffening' of the rear end, when you apply the throttle. That's why I like it ( chain torque reduction) so much, but it does do things quite differently. This also reduces much of the height / stinkbug sensation. I don't particulary like the progressive spring, I've come across, on most of the bikes. There seems to be some 'variable' fitment issues, coming from the factory. And, the forks need quite different settings - once again, along the lines of heavier springs, with minimal pre-load, and damping circuitry, that keeps the front end up, higher in its stroke. A difference, much like the generic difference you see between forks set up for a 4t, as against a set done for a 2t, for a basic example. All bikes, really should be set up for each rider, but Husky, and before that, BMW, should be doing a much better job, with std fitment - or, keeping a closer eye on the shocks / forks that arrive from Kayaba, for correct, as ordered specifications. I wonder - are these Kayabas - especially the forks - being supplied from the Paoli / KYB factory, in Italy? If that situation, still exists?
The tank - seems a good size for most usage. I've made a few bigger, front 'header' tanks, in aluminium, for my mates, that have added capacity, And cured the slow fill up /transfer problem, some encounter, but it's a tricky job, that can only be done at 'mates rates' - And I don't like doing it, at all. I need to learn that word, NO, with my friends. Surely some company can make an effort, with this? I think, the 'header tank', has been the same since the BM 450s inception, through to the Huskies??? I think they could sell a few, if they didn't 'go the gouge', with pricing.
The comparison to a DRZ400?
I can't see that at all, in my experience, but, each persons 'experience' is different. I think, I can trust Chilly to be honest in his opinion, and his opinion, is as relevant as any others.
I can't pass hard comment on the gear ratio issues, as I've only ridden the bikes on the dirt, in my tight areas, with minimal, 'get to the trails', tar usage. But, upon reading Chillies review, I can attest to thinking it was fairly close ratio'd, with not the spread I might have expected. It wouldn't be an issue to me, but, it sounds like they may have applied the same ratio ideas that they've had on previous Husky 'Husky' 450s / 510s?
Seems pretty level headed. I'm pretty familiar with magazine tests, that amount to only the most cursory of rides, especially if the bike is at all different / not the flavour of the month. I've worked in the MC industry, with duties of prepping bikes for testing, years ago, and was appauled when I saw tests of bikes I was involved with, that were given 1 or 2 laps around an MX track. And even test sessions where I saw riders Not ride the bike in question, then be quoted on their opinions of the bike.
It happens.
So, at least Chilly has ridden the bike, for a while - in his words.
I Don't Own a Husky, nor did I own a BMW 450. But, I've ridden them a reasonable amount, and helped mates set theirs up, and 2 of them have had successive BM/Huskies. It's why I've regularly gone after the fools that join in , in trashing the BM / Husky. The majority haven't ridden them, or still have their noses out of joint that DK couldn't ride the bike/ could not stick with the job he was hired for. Good on him, I say, he realised he wasn't a development rider, and walked away from what appeared to be a big bucks deal. Juha, stayed with it, and, got the same placing - 2nd in E2, in the EWC, in 2009, as he did in 2008, on a KTM. It's strange how people don't know that..... He broke his ankle, in early 2010 - I guess that may be a reason to dislike the BM /Husky, too.
They Are a rather different bike, it's undeniable. But, take a bit of time, learn to set them up, and they are Good things.
The vibration problem , IS bloody weird. the 511 /450s I've ridden, were as smooth as silk. The fellow that pointed out the pipe interference issue, might just have it sorted. It's the type of thing that has happened to many bikes. I've come across this on several KTMs, and many other bikes, over the years. That it has gradually improved, for Chilly, might indicate it's 'worn' enough of the pipe / frame - or , the accessory pipe fits a damned sight better! No excuse for parts hitting. I hope that Husky have been made aware that this could be the problem - but it's the sort of thing they should pick up on, at the factory, at the distributors, at a dealership - especially if it's just a matter of correct fitment, as it quite often is, on many bikes.
Just a note about the std Muffler - when I first saw pictures of it, I thought it had to be a photo shop job on it. I even put that up on a thread in KTM Talk. It's the most ridicoulous things I've ever seen. Not that I've ever seen the monstrosity in real life - I've only got near the TEs, with Akros on it - here in OZ, I think you get an Akro with the purchase of the bike? That size, with a CAT - would account for most of the weight it has over the KTM EXC.
By the way - if you tried to ride a KTM EXC, in its std, road legal form, as it comes in OZ, it's quite a pig of a thing, too. As are all ADR'd bikes. So, we are All crims here (don't go there with the Convict jibes, boys) in OZ, as if you modify a bike to perform well, it's no longer legal to ride it, on the street / trails of OZ.
I'm far from appreciative of the body work. But I've disliked Husky styling for quite a while, well before the 449 /511. Reduce the amount of radiator shrouds, Husky, and get rid of that 'no side plate styling, that KTM brought to market. At Least KTM have seen the error of their ways. Bizarely, I like the front fender, not for its looks (yuck!), but for how it works. If I could get an Acerbis, UFO, other brand, single colour / piece replica, I'd put one on my bike.
Not being able to pick the front end up? I don't know what to say. I've not experienced that one. Weirder, than weird. Some drongos have gone on about the reverse rotation of the engine, being a problem, but, by my calculations, I think it adds about 350 grams downward force, at full revs, probably even less - my Maths skills are a bit rusty, so, I'm erring to a higher figure. Add in the different, non squat feel to the rear end, and I can see some finding it quite strange, though
Now, I may be ahead of the curve on CTS type back ends, having used a Torque Eliminator set up on many of my bikes, over the years. I like the neutrality of CTS / Anti Chain Torque / pull rear ends. But, a Vast amount of riders, have ridden nothing but, a std rear end, with it's constantly varying chain torque, and have learned its ways, pretty much, unconciously. To go to a CTS, is something, that some, may never be able to do.
Fair Enough.
Much like a PDS rear end, but, more markedly so, it requires set up, different to the norm. No 100mm of rider sag, 30 /35mm (or whatever) unladen sag.
I've found, that you need to use different 'settings'. A heavier spring, with more laden, and unladen sag, in the rear. With CTS / Anti chain torque devices, you don't have the 'stiffening' of the rear end, when you apply the throttle. That's why I like it ( chain torque reduction) so much, but it does do things quite differently. This also reduces much of the height / stinkbug sensation. I don't particulary like the progressive spring, I've come across, on most of the bikes. There seems to be some 'variable' fitment issues, coming from the factory. And, the forks need quite different settings - once again, along the lines of heavier springs, with minimal pre-load, and damping circuitry, that keeps the front end up, higher in its stroke. A difference, much like the generic difference you see between forks set up for a 4t, as against a set done for a 2t, for a basic example. All bikes, really should be set up for each rider, but Husky, and before that, BMW, should be doing a much better job, with std fitment - or, keeping a closer eye on the shocks / forks that arrive from Kayaba, for correct, as ordered specifications. I wonder - are these Kayabas - especially the forks - being supplied from the Paoli / KYB factory, in Italy? If that situation, still exists?
The tank - seems a good size for most usage. I've made a few bigger, front 'header' tanks, in aluminium, for my mates, that have added capacity, And cured the slow fill up /transfer problem, some encounter, but it's a tricky job, that can only be done at 'mates rates' - And I don't like doing it, at all. I need to learn that word, NO, with my friends. Surely some company can make an effort, with this? I think, the 'header tank', has been the same since the BM 450s inception, through to the Huskies??? I think they could sell a few, if they didn't 'go the gouge', with pricing.
The comparison to a DRZ400?
I can't see that at all, in my experience, but, each persons 'experience' is different. I think, I can trust Chilly to be honest in his opinion, and his opinion, is as relevant as any others.
I can't pass hard comment on the gear ratio issues, as I've only ridden the bikes on the dirt, in my tight areas, with minimal, 'get to the trails', tar usage. But, upon reading Chillies review, I can attest to thinking it was fairly close ratio'd, with not the spread I might have expected. It wouldn't be an issue to me, but, it sounds like they may have applied the same ratio ideas that they've had on previous Husky 'Husky' 450s / 510s?
SAM511
Husqvarna
AA Class
Nope, all of us here have the same feeling.The mags and reviewers hate it and the customers love it. A very polarizing bike for sure. when I read over and over it is a BMW bastard and KTM this and KTM that i think the writing is on the wall. Wonder how this bike had reviewed had it been all new and KTM? It would be on the cover of all the mags and touted as the next best thing. I have two KTM friends that ride nothing but KTM and rode my 511 and agreed it feels lighter, works better and they loved it. Still buy KTM's. It's all good and i don;t want to come across as slamming Chilly, it's his opinion, but like the mags always seems like the same old song. KTM rules and everything else is crap. Wonder how he would like the new Betas? Very nice bikes but real soft power stock and super wimpy suspension stock.
In the end and IMHO KTM's always get the best reviews and praise even if they were covered in after market stuff when tested and lots of time spend sorting them out and husky ALWAYS gets the red headed stepchild review regardless and crap reviews even stating wrong obvious things like 5 speeds when there are 6 etc. (see it in mags all the time). Jodie from Jodies box slammed my decked out husky WR250 at the DR 24hr one year and touting the CRF450 for everything even after saying he had not sampled a husky in over 5 years. He could tell you how to fix the leaky CRF air box with the 7 aftermarket fixes sitting on his desk. Whatever. We just need to enjoy our bikes and use each other for real world information here at CH.
top of the podium.
I admire you for putting the time to reply to the Chilly factor. I agree with all your points, in particular point 11. Sensationalist journalism at its best and it certainly worked as he had hoped.
I know I have modified and optioned up my bike quite a bit but it is the most satisfying bike I have owned.
I have had 3 KTM's (among other bikes) over the last 10-12 years and I must say I love my TE511.
jaythetoolman
Husqvarna
C Class
I will admit that I have not been on an Enduro or dual sport bike in years! I grew up riding Montesa's, Bull Taco, Husqvarna, Maico you get the point. well Ive been lazy as hell sitting on 4wheeler for about 6 years for family sake. about 6 months ago I decided I wanted my youth back and I was going to buy the most bad ass bike there was, so I bought the Husqvarna TE511 when I road it for the first time Ill be honest it was scary powerful holly shit! I just marveled at the technology of this bike, I would go out into my garage at night and just stare at this thing thinking, this thing is the most awesome thing I have ever bought, and it still is. I have gotten used to it now! but I will have to say it vibrates like MO FO! maybe its my 42 year old ass and I have carpel-tunnel or something but my mirrors vibrate to the point they are useless. now if I pull in the clutch they clear up! I was invited to go on my first ride, it was about 200 miles of dirt roads and asphalt in Arkansas. after that ride I could hardly close my hands for a week and I am being serous! I called and talked to the north American Tech for the Eastern portion of the US and he told me "you bought a very powerful machine with no counter balance and it will vibrate! I can feel it in the seat! in the foot pegs! and the bars! I have balanced the wheels and they are fine. I did notice a guy said earlier that his exhaust was hitting the frame I thought of that because when I rev the engine with a solid steel dowel on the side of the engine it is smooth as silk! put it on the exhaust and I could engrave my name in it! it is a thumper and I know this but but the frame thing makes no sense because it bolts to the frame. if anyone has come up with new info I am all ears..