• Hi everyone,

    As you all know, Coffee (Dean) passed away a couple of years ago. I am Dean's ex-wife's husband and happen to have spent my career in tech. Over the years, I occasionally helped Dean with various tech issues.

    When he passed, I worked with his kids to gather the necessary credentials to keep this site running. Since then (and for however long they worked with Coffee), Woodschick and Dirtdame have been maintaining the site and covering the costs. Without their hard work and financial support, CafeHusky would have been lost.

    Over the past couple of weeks, I’ve been working to migrate the site to a free cloud compute instance so that Woodschick and Dirtdame no longer have to fund it. At the same time, I’ve updated the site to a current version of XenForo (the discussion software it runs on). The previous version was outdated and no longer supported.

    Unfortunately, the new software version doesn’t support importing the old site’s styles, so for now, you’ll see the XenForo default style. This may change over time.

    Coffee didn’t document the work he did on the site, so I’ve been digging through the old setup to understand how everything was running. There may still be things I’ve missed. One known issue is that email functionality is not yet working on the new site, but I hope to resolve this over time.

    Thanks for your patience and support!

TR650 Crash bars

It is similar to what the SW Motech uses to attach the two bars. If you look at the SW-Motech bars, they not only attach to the frame downtube, but they have a crossbrace between the two sides that connects using a similar coupler to what is mentioned above. I suspect they are talking about building the same type of cross brace on the Alt-rider bars.

I just don't see the value in it. The SW-Motech cross brace is at roughly the same height as the AltRider frame attachement point. If you go any further up for a cross brace, you run the risk of interfering with the forks as they turn. I'm not saying there isn't space, but it would require some measuring to make sure it would clear.

I think your flex issues really stem from the mounting brackets. The Altrider attachment point is engineered to be much more sturdy than the SW-Motech.

This is the SW-Motech. It uses a plate with the bars welded on a few inches forward of the mount. This plate is more flexible that the tube steel, and will flex to some degree. In my opinion, this is why the SW-Motech bars have to have a cross brace.

sbl_03_319_10000__b_101368780965-9514.jpg


This is the Altrider attachment point. It is, by design, much stronger than the SW-Motech. This design would throw any flexing forces onto the tube steel, which shouldn't really flex given the thickness of it.

installed-altrider-crash-bars-for-the-husqvarna-tr650-terra-and-strada-13.jpg


Also, notice that the Altrider forward frame attachment point is at the same height as the SW-Motech crossbar. The SW-Motech forward frame attachment point is actually lower than the Altrider's. This is why I think the crossbrace is necessary. They have to have that crossbrace to transfer energy over to the other side, that way the cheap bracked won't just bend or snap the weld. I'm not saying the SW-Motech is a bad design, but it meats a pricepoint. That plate bracket is a cheap method of attaching it, and it comes at the expense of strength.
 
RidingDonkeys said:
I just don't see the value in it. The SW-Motech cross brace is at roughly the same height as the AltRider frame attachement point. If you go any further up for a cross brace, you run the risk of interfering with the forks as they turn. I'm not saying there isn't space, but it would require some measuring to make sure it would clear.

I think your flex issues really stem from the mounting brackets. The Altrider attachment point is engineered to be much more sturdy than the SW-Motech.

This is the SW-Motech. It uses a plate with the bars welded on a few inches forward of the mount. This plate is more flexible that the tube steel, and will flex to some degree. In my opinion, this is why the SW-Motech bars have to have a cross brace.

This is the Altrider attachment point. It is, by design, much stronger than the SW-Motech. This design would throw any flexing forces onto the tube steel, which shouldn't really flex given the thickness of it.


Also, notice that the Altrider forward frame attachment point is at the same height as the SW-Motech crossbar. The SW-Motech forward frame attachment point is actually lower than the Altrider's. This is why I think the crossbrace is necessary. They have to have that crossbrace to transfer energy over to the other side, that way the cheap bracked won't just bend or snap the weld. I'm not saying the SW-Motech is a bad design, but it meats a pricepoint. That plate bracket is a cheap method of attaching it, and it comes at the expense of strength.
Click to expand...


SO here is what worries me... The ALTrider bars extend further away from the mounting points - right above the Husky badge. I would say maybe almost twice as far as the SWM's. This is GOOD because there is a lot of coverage, this is BAD because you have effectively created a longer lever to put a torque on the mounting point.

The altrider bars do not have a crossbrace. This is GOOD because the should cost less and be easier to install. This is BAD because now all the force from an impact is only absorbed through two points on the frame. The SWM bars have a crossbrace and would transfer the force to all four points the bars are bolted on to the frame.

The bracket on the SWM bars does look less sturdy than the ALTrider bars. However I believe it is done so because it should effectively be handling 1/4 the force of the ALTrider bars (1/2 as much from a smaller lever arm and 1/2 as much from having twice as many mounting points). I also think they put that bracket in so that they could move the bars further away from the riders knees.

I also think that fab has a point - especially as he made bars that were very close in design to the ALTrider bars, Fab made them first of course:notworthy:



FabOneUp said:
If they keep them this way without a cross bars for extra support, I would go with the Motech's if I had to choose between them as they sit.....but again I/we are sure they are not finished. Too much flex the way they sit without a cross support....trust me!:)
Click to expand...
In fact, fab has TWO cross braces...
FabOneUp said:
The whole enchilada!
View attachment 24146 View attachment 24147 View attachment 24148 View attachment 24149
Click to expand...

And FAB's bars are of course the pinnacle of engineering - all the coverage of ALTrider bars, but with the IMHO necessary cross brace.

I think I will be going with the ALTrider's and just adding in a crossbrace. As I do agree with you I think the materials and welds are better, but I fear the engineering is lacking...

I just hope I can get some confirmation that there would be room for a cross brace - even if I had to trim off some of that radiator shroud...:thinking:
 
Enjoying the discussion, nothing better to do now as neither the SW-Motech or Alt Rider stuff is available in the US yet. Hopefully the alt-rider folks make the 6-11 date. I've got a preference for the SW-Motech design, but I'd go either way if I could get either. The Sw-Motech stuff is allegedly soon, but I'm not super confident.
 
krussell said:
I've got a preference for the SW-Motech design, but I'd go either way if I could get either. The Sw-Motech stuff is allegedly soon, but I'm not super confident.
Click to expand...

I was told by Aaron from Twisted Throttle my SW-Motech Crash bars and Skid plate are here and will be shipped by tomorrow. Not sure if all they have are spoken for or not. But worth a call I'd say.:thumbsup:
 
Coffee said:
I'm having trouble visualizing how this would be used. Pic somewhere?
Click to expand...


The OP said he was thinking about welding in a cross member into the altrider crash bars.
I'd assume the cross member would go in as two pieces, one of each crash bar, joined by this coupler.

That's my interpretation anyhow......
 
Alan Riston said:
The OP said he was thinking about welding in a cross member into the altrider crash bars.
I'd assume the cross member would go in as two pieces, one of each crash bar, joined by this coupler.

That's my interpretation anyhow......
Click to expand...

exactly like that.

in fact I might do two like Fab1Up
 
I love Fab's design too.

Just for comparison, Altrider bars are Stainless Steel, 1" (25.4mm) 0.082" thick (2mm), but no mention of grade, 304, 316 etc.
SW-Motech are some type of heavy duty mild steel, 22mm OD (about 7/8") but no info on wall thickness.

If you're happy welding SS the Altrider is probably your option, otherwise the SWM would be a little easier to mod. Not everyone has a Tig welder, or the skill to do it like Fab does. Guess you can always get someone to do it for you, though

I agree with Allen, the SW bars are shorter, and the bending moment forces on the mounting points would be less than if the same deign was used for the Altriders. So I think they'd be both very strong.

The Aus distributor of SW-Motech has pics of the bike on the ground

http://www.motorradgarage.com.au/crash-bars-husqvarna-tr650-terra-strada-12-

Crash%20Bars%20TR650%20copy3-528x429.jpg
terra%201-528x429.jpg


I've not seen any shots like this of the Altriders. Handlebar position will also affect what touches/scrapes etc in a lay down. I'd say the Altrider bars only offer a fraction more protection than this based on the pictures available. If Altrider could provide some comparable laydown sally pics of their product, it's be great.
 
Allen said:
exactly like that.

in fact I might do two like Fab1Up
Click to expand...
They truly need two. If someone wants to save cost at the weld shop, then choose a lower cross brace, but it should be bolted to both bars AND the frame to gain the strength you seek.

Try not to get kicked out of your bike building class this summer Allen. The instructors get pissed when you know more than they do.:)
 
Harder1 posted this pic in the pre-order thread. For those interested, it gives a better idea of how far forward the Altrider bars extend. Looks like you'll need a slight bend to get your cross-brace around the frame. Shouldn't be hard.

90-jpg.24311


I was certain they posted pics of their TR on its side with their bars, but I can't seem to find them. Too many threads, too little time.
 
Tazzierob said:
I love Fab's design too.

The Aus distributor of SW-Motech has pics of the bike on the ground

http://www.motorradgarage.com.au/crash-bars-husqvarna-tr650-terra-strada-12-

Crash%20Bars%20TR650%20copy3-528x429.jpg


.
Click to expand...

I looked all over the internet for this pic. THANKS! Now I wonder how hard it it is to roll the bike the rest of the way over. This may be a good option - I seem to recall all my crashes going down in slow motion as I try to hold the bike up...



FabOneUp said:
They truly need two. If someone wants to save cost at the weld shop, then choose a lower cross brace, but it should be bolted to both bars AND the frame to gain the strength you seek.

Try not to get kicked out of your bike building class this summer Allen. The instructors get pissed when you know more than they do.:)
Click to expand...


I am the typical physics nerd - lots of talk but I left my time machine in my other jacket...

:( It saddens me greatly to tell you I had to withdraw from the class. Somehow I got the most beautiful, wonderful girl to move from NYC to Austin, TX with me :love: and I cancelled the class so we could move together. I figured that me taking a two week course on bike building, disappearing into the backwoods of Colorado, and letting her move all our stuff 2,000 miles by herself would not be the best way to start off... That comes later in the relationship right?
 
All the girl, all the time. Good choice Allen! I had my bike set up to lay down and see the effectiveness of the bars. I started to lay it down and decided I didn't want to pick it back up and aborted the mission. I only want to pick this thing up on my own when I have to.
 
Allen said:
I got the most beautiful, wonderful girl to move from NYC to Austin, TX with me :love: and I cancelled the class so we could move together.
Click to expand...

Austin is a good choice. I like it down there. There is something to be said for year-roud riding and low taxes.
 
I have a set of SW Motech crash bars coming from mario33....waiting is killing me ......if all my stuff shows up I'm gona go riding and riding and riding......
 
Another option to avoid welding to those nice new stainless steel tubes. With my welding skills and my equipment, I doubt the outcome would be positive. I think I could handle steel tube to steel clamps. Trail-Gear.com

Tube Clamps
Rod Ends and Link Material




Trail-Gear O.D. Tube Clamps are ideal for suspension and steering brackets that you need attached to a section of tubing when you don’t want to weld the bracket directly to the tubing because adjustment or frequent removal of the bracket is needed.
The O.D. Tube Clamp is perfect for attaching shock brackets to suspension link or steering brackets to steering rods or links and allows you to attach steel mounting brackets that are readily available to aluminum suspension links and steering rods that you could not otherwise weld steel brackets to.
Manufactured from 1020 steel, with a clamping force of up to 8,600lbs these tube clamps will not fail even under the most extreme circumstances. Sold Individually.
Kit Includes:
  • (6) 1/4-20 x 7/8" zinc-plated screws
  • (2) Clamp Halves
Available Options:
  • O.D. Tube Clamps, 1", 180129-KIT
  • O.D. Tube Clamps, 1 1/4", 180128-KIT
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$33.00
O.D. Tube Clamps: *Please selectO.D. Tube Clamps, 1", 180129-KITO.D. Tube Clamps, 1 1/4", 180128-KITO.D. Tube Clamps, 1 1/2", 180127-KITO.D. Tube Clamps, 1 3/4", 180126-KITO.D. Tube Clamps, 2", 180125-KIT
Quantity:
 
I'm failing to see how this these tube clamps would eliminate welding. You still have two loops on each side of the bike, meaning no bare ends to clamp. It seems like you would still have to weld the crossbrace into each side of the crashbars, and then use this clamp to link them together on the front of the bike behind the forks.
 
RidingDonkeys said:
I'm failing to see how this these tube clamps would eliminate welding. You still have two loops on each side of the bike, meaning no bare ends to clamp. It seems like you would still have to weld the crossbrace into each side of the crashbars, and then use this clamp to link them together on the front of the bike behind the forks.
Click to expand...


It wouldn't eliminate welding. It would give you a mechanism to remove the crashbars. Your description is entirely accurate.
 
But you could weld a bar to a clamp on each side more easily (as it is steel as opposed to stainless), and it could be bolted to the crash bar rather than welding to the crash bar itself
 
both the sw mototech and the altrider bars do not seem to be in stock yet. Does anyone have an ETA, or already got theirs?
 
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