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Hi everyone,
As you all know, Coffee (Dean) passed away a couple of years ago. I am Dean's ex-wife's husband and happen to have spent my career in tech. Over the years, I occasionally helped Dean with various tech issues.
When he passed, I worked with his kids to gather the necessary credentials to keep this site running. Since then (and for however long they worked with Coffee), Woodschick and Dirtdame have been maintaining the site and covering the costs. Without their hard work and financial support, CafeHusky would have been lost.
Over the past couple of weeks, I’ve been working to migrate the site to a free cloud compute instance so that Woodschick and Dirtdame no longer have to fund it. At the same time, I’ve updated the site to a current version of XenForo (the discussion software it runs on). The previous version was outdated and no longer supported.
Unfortunately, the new software version doesn’t support importing the old site’s styles, so for now, you’ll see the XenForo default style. This may change over time.
Coffee didn’t document the work he did on the site, so I’ve been digging through the old setup to understand how everything was running. There may still be things I’ve missed. One known issue is that email functionality is not yet working on the new site, but I hope to resolve this over time.
Thanks for your patience and support!
2011 TE449 Running well with factory EFI system - finally
- Thread starter Dangermouse449
- Start date
Big Timmy
Husqvarna
Pro Class
You think you guys are confused or some of you are on the fence about this flap mod? Dangermouse has got it figured out I think and can explain it very well also. Great reference for all of us whether the ECUs are different down under in Aussy or not,or whether the gas has higher octane etc. It works for him and many others with out dumping an extra pile of money at it.
Heres my situation, I have the 2011 Husky TC449 engine in my BMW G450X with the stock 2 flap FI system. My bike runs pretty good but I have experienced Flame outs in rocky hill climbs that have lead to get offs at slow speeds. Not good! Tinken won't touch my BMW G450X ECU. I have thought about the PCV with autotune? I'm not sure if I want to spend that kind of cash right off (500.00) so have thought about removing the second flap myself? I could pick up the original single flap unit from the guy I bought my TC449 engine from (Its available for about 180.00 or so).
Will the TC TBI work with my BMW G450X ECU, Tinken??? I get pushed aside and ignored like a red headed stepchild. I have a half brother in my family that actually is one of those, he's even left handed. Thats not me though. It's not like the thing is so much different than your 449s and 511s. Hell I'm going to be building a big bore out of my BMW 450 engine soon with Husky parts will that make this even worse. I would think not as its just a hybrid not a mutant.
All of this information is great if you ask me, please keep it coming as nothing mentioned here yet in my opinion is totally specific to anyones riding style or particular set up. It's all good. Riding on some of the terrain I ride on in the high desert here in South East Arizona certainly isn't the same as running my bike on a Dyno thats so true.
I am familiar with dyno tuning as I have pulled the lever on my own $35,000 572" Cu.in. All Aluminum Chrysler (Indy Maxx) Hemi for my race car to the tune of about 940+ HP at 8300 rpm but it still needed plenty of tuning to go down the dragstrip at 8.40s in the quarter mile and all you do with that thing is hold it wide open so so much for Dyno Numbers.
I can't get any answers to my specific wants or needs and everyone who could maybe help won't touch my particular set up with a 10 ft. pole. Again my opinion! All of these applications about mapping and throttle bodies having there flaps removed etc. above seem to be specific to the Husky set ups but I believe my ECU is very much the same. The throttle body is the same also. I can't get any answers on that either.. These mods could maybe make my set up better also but I'm on my own. So please keep the info coming everybody I'll do the thrash sooner than later. I sure won't get educated about this on the BMW forums. Since its a BMW everyone thinks I'm crazy. I had it before the Huskys came out around here with the same engine that I was aware of. My Bikes got a complete KTM front end and wheel on it also, does that make my situation worse or anymore crazy??
By the way My G450X was owned by a BMW dealerships owner himself and I know he had to have tweaked with it a bit as he raced it in the veterans class enduros up north in some events. I haven't been able to really ask him anything about the bike since the initial purchase as even himself treats me like the plague. I don't know if he's pissed that I now own it and have improved it so much or what? He isn't open to talk about this "used bike". I gave up, as I couldn't get anywhere with him or his shop mechanic technician or one of the salesmen whom also had a G450X is even worse to try to talk to. They all act like they didn't know anything about it and hell it was his own bike. He seems offended that I have even turned a wrench on the thing. So I won't even walk into the place. That came about over Torque Limiter issues while picking up a new one I had ordered over the phone and I went in to pick it up. That was a month after they sold me clutch plates first that didn't help of course. When I picked up the Torque Limiter, I simply asked if I could bring in the old one and have it tested, of course being willing to pay for his time after he said he had the socket and holding fixture and he was such an ASS about it, I haven't gone in the place since. That was about 3+ years ago. Go figure!
Keep this post going please, this is about sharing basic knowledge information and experience in the field riding. Its not about spending a boatload of money or selling your products.. Again just my opinion!
Heres my situation, I have the 2011 Husky TC449 engine in my BMW G450X with the stock 2 flap FI system. My bike runs pretty good but I have experienced Flame outs in rocky hill climbs that have lead to get offs at slow speeds. Not good! Tinken won't touch my BMW G450X ECU. I have thought about the PCV with autotune? I'm not sure if I want to spend that kind of cash right off (500.00) so have thought about removing the second flap myself? I could pick up the original single flap unit from the guy I bought my TC449 engine from (Its available for about 180.00 or so).
Will the TC TBI work with my BMW G450X ECU, Tinken??? I get pushed aside and ignored like a red headed stepchild. I have a half brother in my family that actually is one of those, he's even left handed. Thats not me though. It's not like the thing is so much different than your 449s and 511s. Hell I'm going to be building a big bore out of my BMW 450 engine soon with Husky parts will that make this even worse. I would think not as its just a hybrid not a mutant.
All of this information is great if you ask me, please keep it coming as nothing mentioned here yet in my opinion is totally specific to anyones riding style or particular set up. It's all good. Riding on some of the terrain I ride on in the high desert here in South East Arizona certainly isn't the same as running my bike on a Dyno thats so true.
I am familiar with dyno tuning as I have pulled the lever on my own $35,000 572" Cu.in. All Aluminum Chrysler (Indy Maxx) Hemi for my race car to the tune of about 940+ HP at 8300 rpm but it still needed plenty of tuning to go down the dragstrip at 8.40s in the quarter mile and all you do with that thing is hold it wide open so so much for Dyno Numbers.
I can't get any answers to my specific wants or needs and everyone who could maybe help won't touch my particular set up with a 10 ft. pole. Again my opinion! All of these applications about mapping and throttle bodies having there flaps removed etc. above seem to be specific to the Husky set ups but I believe my ECU is very much the same. The throttle body is the same also. I can't get any answers on that either.. These mods could maybe make my set up better also but I'm on my own. So please keep the info coming everybody I'll do the thrash sooner than later. I sure won't get educated about this on the BMW forums. Since its a BMW everyone thinks I'm crazy. I had it before the Huskys came out around here with the same engine that I was aware of. My Bikes got a complete KTM front end and wheel on it also, does that make my situation worse or anymore crazy??
By the way My G450X was owned by a BMW dealerships owner himself and I know he had to have tweaked with it a bit as he raced it in the veterans class enduros up north in some events. I haven't been able to really ask him anything about the bike since the initial purchase as even himself treats me like the plague. I don't know if he's pissed that I now own it and have improved it so much or what? He isn't open to talk about this "used bike". I gave up, as I couldn't get anywhere with him or his shop mechanic technician or one of the salesmen whom also had a G450X is even worse to try to talk to. They all act like they didn't know anything about it and hell it was his own bike. He seems offended that I have even turned a wrench on the thing. So I won't even walk into the place. That came about over Torque Limiter issues while picking up a new one I had ordered over the phone and I went in to pick it up. That was a month after they sold me clutch plates first that didn't help of course. When I picked up the Torque Limiter, I simply asked if I could bring in the old one and have it tested, of course being willing to pay for his time after he said he had the socket and holding fixture and he was such an ASS about it, I haven't gone in the place since. That was about 3+ years ago. Go figure!
Keep this post going please, this is about sharing basic knowledge information and experience in the field riding. Its not about spending a boatload of money or selling your products.. Again just my opinion!
Muchmore
Husqvarna
AA Class
Dangermouse someone has to step up and ignore the negativity. I love this thread because I have learned that a simple modification worked for me at your suggestion, I really try to listen to everyone's little tricks if it's not to much trouble. If ANYONE has other tricks to try like this or that might help this mod work better please post because I love the information from ALL angles.
Going against traditional wisdom helped my bike run better so I would like more of the same
Going against traditional wisdom helped my bike run better so I would like more of the same
This is fun!
I will add a bit here.
Air velocity is important even in a fuel injected vehicle. Direct injection, not so much. But all we have is a injector or "JET" that has high pressure pulses coming out of it into the intake manifold but also directed at the intake ports. If there is not enough air velocity the fuel will not entirely enter the chamber. Think this is happening so fast it is hard to even imagine. If a little fuel is not drawn in at every hit every time it is a loss of efficiency and you must then inject more fuel to prevent the lean condition. The tc throttle body looks to be smaller, maybe tinken can verify. This would explain a lot.
I think the intake/air filter is restrictive enough to create enough vaccum for this to be a non issue, again we are talking at idle-3500rpm with a massive throttle body opening 100%.
I have cured my previous flameout or cough I described by tuning the ACCELERATOR PUMP function in my power commander V. I added 15% fuel at a preemptive 5% throttle for 50rpm's.
If I had the stock airbox and filter, I likely would not have had much of an issue, but because my intake is very open (possibly tinkens problem also) it becomes noticeable. From an engineering standpoint I bet the secondary throttle will seem "necessary" but in reality the lack of it even with a wide open intake is negligible.
Also dangermouse,
I do not think the factory ecu reacts to map pressure at all. I am 99% sure. There is no way it is that "smart". I think it simply used the o2 sensor to tune it lean, without regard to manifold vaccum.
Its not speed density in racemap it is just basic rpm, throttle position mapping only.
I think the mod is great, and cures some peoples issues and makes the bike more rideable. But, we are quite lucky it is working well for most as it seems sensitive to other modifications.
I will add a bit here.
Air velocity is important even in a fuel injected vehicle. Direct injection, not so much. But all we have is a injector or "JET" that has high pressure pulses coming out of it into the intake manifold but also directed at the intake ports. If there is not enough air velocity the fuel will not entirely enter the chamber. Think this is happening so fast it is hard to even imagine. If a little fuel is not drawn in at every hit every time it is a loss of efficiency and you must then inject more fuel to prevent the lean condition. The tc throttle body looks to be smaller, maybe tinken can verify. This would explain a lot.
I think the intake/air filter is restrictive enough to create enough vaccum for this to be a non issue, again we are talking at idle-3500rpm with a massive throttle body opening 100%.
I have cured my previous flameout or cough I described by tuning the ACCELERATOR PUMP function in my power commander V. I added 15% fuel at a preemptive 5% throttle for 50rpm's.
If I had the stock airbox and filter, I likely would not have had much of an issue, but because my intake is very open (possibly tinkens problem also) it becomes noticeable. From an engineering standpoint I bet the secondary throttle will seem "necessary" but in reality the lack of it even with a wide open intake is negligible.
Also dangermouse,
I do not think the factory ecu reacts to map pressure at all. I am 99% sure. There is no way it is that "smart". I think it simply used the o2 sensor to tune it lean, without regard to manifold vaccum.
Its not speed density in racemap it is just basic rpm, throttle position mapping only.
I think the mod is great, and cures some peoples issues and makes the bike more rideable. But, we are quite lucky it is working well for most as it seems sensitive to other modifications.
there is a hole going to a sensor right below the main BF, I would think that is measuring vacuum or something.
Big Timmy
Husqvarna
Pro Class
O.K. then Tinken, thanks for the tip and Info. I don't have the TC injector but could get it. I think I will stick with the one I got others like my own can be had for 75.00 on ebay under G450X parts where the TC one is 199.00 in Husky parts. I don't want to buy something that I possibly can't use. I got a garage full of spares for the G450X now.
Oh, by the way Tinken. I have been endorsing your breather and drain plug fittings like crazy on the G450 riders forum and many are getting them set up and installed with pictures posted. A few recently from Australia and even further away than that. They are having to use the Toxic Moto tanks to do this but thats what is available. Myself and BigDom from South Africa who frequents this forum also have helped you sell quite a few over the last few months.
Option 1: I guess the next thing to do is buy the PCV with the autotune set up combined and install it.
Option 2: Buy The New Fe 501 Husky I've been looking at and start throwing parts at it instead.. Licenseing it here where I live, no problem.
Option 3: Buy The New Beta 498 race version, I've also been looking at next to the Husky's and KTMs at the same dealership with an included head and tail light and build it the way I want it. that would be the "Build your own Beta plan". Directly from Beta with all the best stuff available direct and do the same as Option 2: (Get it registered and plated) and go back to a carburetor and avoid most of the above. Decisions, Decisions,
All of you keep up the good work . I love this good stuff.
Everyone needs to go have a cold one and come back tomorrow.
Dangermouse's initial post on this subject was well done and left room for further experimentation so I immediately added it to the 449/511 guide page. Feedback from almost everyone so far is that this has made the bikes better.
Tinkens work with ECUs and PV and oil management has helped all of us make these bikes better since 2011.
Farther back than that Motosportz introduced us to the JD Jetting upgrade, which I personally applied to both a 511 and 449 with happy results. Try as he might, Tinken wasnt able to persuade me to jump on the PV bandwagon....and I had locked ECUs so I didnt get to enjoy the Map 3 upgrade either.
A small percentage of owners have found all this knowledge still lacking (and some like Big Timmy are throwing a unique set of variables into the mix) so the tinkering will continue.
In the meantime I see no reason for the snarky comments, direct challenges to the motives of others and similar nonsense.
Cafe Husky is a valuable place because we understand how to be civilized and evolve and challenge each other without tearing each other down.
In summary .....
Knock it Off, please !!
Dangermouse's initial post on this subject was well done and left room for further experimentation so I immediately added it to the 449/511 guide page. Feedback from almost everyone so far is that this has made the bikes better.
Tinkens work with ECUs and PV and oil management has helped all of us make these bikes better since 2011.
Farther back than that Motosportz introduced us to the JD Jetting upgrade, which I personally applied to both a 511 and 449 with happy results. Try as he might, Tinken wasnt able to persuade me to jump on the PV bandwagon....and I had locked ECUs so I didnt get to enjoy the Map 3 upgrade either.
A small percentage of owners have found all this knowledge still lacking (and some like Big Timmy are throwing a unique set of variables into the mix) so the tinkering will continue.
In the meantime I see no reason for the snarky comments, direct challenges to the motives of others and similar nonsense.
Cafe Husky is a valuable place because we understand how to be civilized and evolve and challenge each other without tearing each other down.
In summary .....
Knock it Off, please !!
Cosmokenney
Husqvarna
Pro Class
No no. That's where the monster is that tried to eat the millenium falcon. C'mon man you gotta pay more attention.
underwatersimon
Husqvarna
AA Class
First off, I have been following this form from its inception and appreciate the comments and knowledge that available here.
My question is a little off topic but has been mentioned here so I'll throw it out there in an effort to better understand my bike.
How or is changing the position of the TPS affected by by doing a "TPS reset" ?
Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
My question is a little off topic but has been mentioned here so I'll throw it out there in an effort to better understand my bike.
How or is changing the position of the TPS affected by by doing a "TPS reset" ?
Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
I was thinking this same thing. I dont know but in theory it would seem like to me the if you moved the TPS physically and then did a TPS reset it would do just that, reset, and then you'd be right back where you were. Maybe not but seems that would be the case at least in the range of the adjustment. Good question.
Dangermouse449
Husqvarna
Pro Class
I have just videoed my bike starting from cold, at idle with no intervention, first crank after 2 weeks parked, started normally.
I have also just videoed it when warm having the the throttle cracked around to full throttle from idle without ANY hesitation what-so-ever, letting it rest & going again 2 more times.
* When I work out how to post a video on the forum from my laptop, I will post them up.
I don't use my Youtube account, so would prefer not to link from that if there are other options.
I have also just videoed it when warm having the the throttle cracked around to full throttle from idle without ANY hesitation what-so-ever, letting it rest & going again 2 more times.
* When I work out how to post a video on the forum from my laptop, I will post them up.
I don't use my Youtube account, so would prefer not to link from that if there are other options.
Dangermouse449
Husqvarna
Pro Class
So here are the videos of the standard Aussie delivered TE449 with supplied slip-on & no other added hardware. Running 98oct pump fuel.
No butterfly or piggyback fitted & running fine. No bog, no hesitation & cold start without intervention.
(Before this morning, I honestly wasn't even aware if the bike could snap to full throttle from idle as I had never tried it.
It isn't something I do when I ride)
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10203358986312601&set=o.219900571553501&type=3&theater
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10203359135956342&set=o.219900571553501&type=3&theater
Let me know if it sounds a little 'off' to you. Please
No butterfly or piggyback fitted & running fine. No bog, no hesitation & cold start without intervention.
(Before this morning, I honestly wasn't even aware if the bike could snap to full throttle from idle as I had never tried it.
It isn't something I do when I ride)
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10203358986312601&set=o.219900571553501&type=3&theater
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10203359135956342&set=o.219900571553501&type=3&theater
Let me know if it sounds a little 'off' to you. Please
Dangermouse449
Husqvarna
Pro Class
You are correct, there will still need to be some air movement, but with the injector so close to the valves, it is still capable of big throttle openings.
The TE body in Tinkens picture has a reamed out non-factory size inlet.
Yes the pcv is capable of masking the problem too.
The rest of my setup is standard as stated.
Have a view of the videos, pretty much sums up what i have been saying from the start.
If it is a lightly modified bike, the mods work fine.
You could be right about the map not being used, but I think it would run pretty badly with the butterfly out if just tps based load sensing. I think it might be tps for idle running & map for non-idle. A common setup in big cam na race engines.
Pulling out the map from the port, sealing the hole & leaving the wires connected would tell you. If it runs, it is throttle based, if not, map based.
If the maps only purpose was for atmospheric reference on start up, seems like waste of a port in the TB.
Lon
Husqvarna
AA Class
So here are the videos of the standard Aussie delivered TE449 with supplied slip-on & no other added hardware. Running 98oct pump fuel.
No butterfly or piggyback fitted & running fine. No bog, no hesitation & cold start without intervention.
(Before this morning, I honestly wasn't even aware if the bike could snap to full throttle from idle as I had never tried it.
It isn't something I do when I ride)
Let me know if it sounds a little 'off' to you. Please
Acts as mine does.
To me, your idle sounds a little low. But then, getting the idle right on these is guesswork without a tacho.
Dangermouse449
Husqvarna
Pro Class
9880sts
Husqvarna
AA Class
Here my Bike ... same thing. Aussie Bike but with FMF and all mod's done.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10203074330971474&set=o.219900571553501&type=2&theater
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10203074299050676&set=o.219900571553501&type=2&theater
i don't want to put more details on here. Bike works .
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10203074330971474&set=o.219900571553501&type=2&theater
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10203074299050676&set=o.219900571553501&type=2&theater
i don't want to put more details on here. Bike works .
bigmo
Husqvarna
AA Class
I am pretty convinced that the cleaner is just repackaged Oxy Clean - or at least VERY close. My first few cleans were with the official cleaner, but find the Oxy Clean just as good with no extra effort required. Plus, we ALWAYS have it in the house (I have one high school athlete and one the rides horse - so mud is a way of life for us).
N4544D
Husqvarna
AA Class
So here are the videos of the standard Aussie delivered TE449 with supplied slip-on & no other added hardware. Running 98oct pump fuel.
No butterfly or piggyback fitted & running fine. No bog, no hesitation & cold start without intervention.
(Before this morning, I honestly wasn't even aware if the bike could snap to full throttle from idle as I had never tried it.
It isn't something I do when I ride)
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10203358986312601&set=o.219900571553501&type=3&theater
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10203359135956342&set=o.219900571553501&type=3&theater
Let me know if it sounds a little 'off' to you. Please
Sound just like mine, exact quick light off and steady idle speed! Like you, I took the idle just out of the running rough range, which was 2.5 turns out on the air bypass screw. I need a little bit of throttle when starting warm (it's the same with or without the FBW butterfly). Thanks for your contribution to the forum!
Just so we are comparing Oranges to Oranges, Euro / UK / Australia "Super Unleaded" at 97-99 Octane is similar to North American "Super Unleaded" at 92-95 Octane due to the differences in the octane rating measurement methods (RON in Australia and AKI in North America).